Let's Meet ALEC

[stumbler]

Now maybe its just my own ignorance but I did not know a group that's been calling itself the American Legislative Exchange Council has actively been "helping" states draft legislation since 1978.

And it seems like something I should have known about.

But now it seems almost inescapable and I've been meeting ALEC everywhere I go. And come to find out this mostly conservative organization has been incredibly successful in getting their laws passed and seem to have their influences everywhere. Including apparently how to make money off jailing and holding suspected illegal immigrants.

But what got me is that somehow in the middle of this story on increased immigration raids and deportations I find out more about ALEC than I've learned in all the latest press reports I've seen.

The video states that behind the words and laws, there is an alliance of businesses and politicians called the American Legislative Exchange Council, or ALEC. Some of ALEC's members are both the most ardent proponents of anti-immigration laws and representatives of the industries that will benefit directly from having more people behind bars. At least 12 companies involved in the corrections industry are members of the alliance.


ALEC was created in 1978 and is headquartered in Washington, D.C. According to the group's mission statement, it is "a non-profit, private organization dedicated to principles of free markets, limited government, federalism (the proper balance of federal and state government), and individual liberty." ALEC achieves these aims through a exchange of ideas between state politicians and business leaders, facilitating the legislative process around certain causes dear to the latter. Through one of ALEC’s eight committees, lawyers and business experts actually write laws that are later enacted almost verbatim.



Each year, ALEC produces approximately 1000 legislative proposals, 20 percent of which eventually become laws, according to the group. The Center for Media and Democracy's PR Watch reports: "98% of ALEC's funding comes from corporations like Exxon Mobil, corporate 'foundations' like the Charles G. Koch Charitable Foundation, or trade associations like the pharmaceutical industry's PhRMA."


Cuéntame focuses on ALEC members' use of political pressure to achieve more restrictive immigration laws, which require longer detentions and a larger number of detainees.



Some of ALEC's model bills include the "three Strikes" law, changes in mandatory minimum sentences and "truth-in-sentencing," which would further eliminate the possibility of parole for many inmates.



Yet ALEC rejects the idea that it promotes increased construction of private prisons. In a statement last October, the group said, "ALEC’s position on prison overcrowding ... is to reduce the non-violent prison population in order to save taxpayer costs."



One of the best known legislative members of ALEC is State Senator Russell Pearce, a proponent of Arizona's very restrictive immigration law, SB 1070. According to an investigation by NPR, Pearce took his version of the legislation to an ALEC meeting, where it was then revised and adapted by members of the corrections industry, obtaining their unqualified support.



SB 1070 has been imitated by similar laws -- some even stricter and more encompassing -- in at least five other states. These include HB 56 in Alabama, Utah's Compact / HB 497, Indiana's SB 590, Georgia's HB 87 and South Carolina's S 20.



ALEC is now working on a series of laws concerning prisons, including The Housing Out-of-State Prisoners in a Private Prison Act; The Prison Industries Act; The Inmate Labor Disclosure Act; A Resolution on Prison Expenditures; a Model State Bill Prohibiting Wireless Handsets in Prisons; the Targeted Contracting for Certain Correctional Facilities and Services Act; and the Prevention of Illegal Payments to Inmates Incentives Act, details of which are restricted to ALEC members only.


One of ALEC's members is Corrections Corporation of America, the country's largest for-profit prison company, founded in 1983. CCA designs, builds, manages and operates correctional facilities and detention centers on behalf of the Federal Bureau of Prisons, Immigration and Customs Enforcement and the United States Marshal Service in nearly half of all states, according to the company's website.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_926542.html


ALEC it turns out is one of the most frightening things I've ever seen and I plan on tracking ALEC right here.

[tenguy]

Originally Posted by stumbler

ALEC it turns out is one of the most frightening things I've ever seen and I plan on tracking ALEC right here.

Frightening? Now I understand why you like to type in pink, bold letters. You are a sissy.

Here, instead of sitting there shaking in your boots reading about them on Huffy, why not read about ALEC on their "hidden" website.

http://www.alec.org/AM/Template.cfm?Section=Home

[ace's n 8's]

Originally Posted by stumbler

Now maybe its just my own ignorance but I did not know a group that's been calling itself the American Legislative Exchange Council has actively been "helping" states draft legislation since 1978.

And it seems like something I should have known about.

But now it seems almost inescapable and I've been meeting ALEC everywhere I go. And come to find out this mostly conservative organization has been incredibly successful in getting their laws passed and seem to have their influences everywhere. Including apparently how to make money off jailing and holding suspected illegal immigrants.

But what got me is that somehow in the middle of this story on increased immigration raids and deportations I find out more about ALEC than I've learned in all the latest press reports I've seen.




http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/0..._n_926542.html


ALEC it turns out is one of the most frightening things I've ever seen and I plan on tracking ALEC right here.

Frightening???fuck they are not frightening,,nothing like some shit that I have seen, like ACORN, George Soros, Steven Chu and Obama with his unlimited Czars.

I'll deeply thank you for bringing ALEC to the light, now I know someone is on my side,,,FINALLY. The thought of an organization that has my views of limited government....Hell I'm even going to put their site right up on my toolbar.

[stumbler]

Originally Posted by tenguy

Frightening? Now I understand why you like to type in pink, bold letters. You are a sissy.

Here, instead of sitting there shaking in your boots reading about them on Huffy, why not read about ALEC on their "hidden" website.

http://www.alec.org/AM/Template.cfm?Section=Home

I think the hysteric would be the one who starts out telling lies like implying i said (or even thought) that ALEC is somehow hidden which is something in never said or implied.

But to get the record straight to begin with I think this cautionary note from University of Wisconsin Professor William Cronon sums my feelings on ALEC up very well.

Let's begin with a high note of Caution:

A Cautionary Note

What you’ll quickly learn even from reading these few documents is that ALEC is an organization that has been doing very important political work in the United States for the past forty years with remarkably little public or journalistic scrutiny. I’m posting this long note in the conviction that it’s time to start paying more attention. History is being made here, and future historians need people today to assemble the documents they’ll eventually need to write this story. Much more important, citizens today may wish to access these same documents to be well informed about important political decisions being made in our own time during the frequent meetings that ALEC organizes between Republican legislators and representatives of many of the wealthiest corporations in the United States.


I want to add a word of caution here at the end. In posting this study guide, I do not want to suggest that I think it is illegitimate in a democracy for citizens who share political convictions to gather for the purpose of sharing ideas or creating strategies to pursue their shared goals. The right to assemble, form alliances, share resources, and pursue common ends is crucial to any vision of democracy I know. (That’s one reason I’m appalled at Governor Walker’s ALEC-supported efforts to shut down public employee unions in Wisconsin, even though I have never belonged to one of those unions, probably never will, and have sometimes been quite critical of their tactics and strategies.) I’m not suggesting that ALEC, its members, or its allies are illegitimate, corrupt, or illegal. If money were changing hands to buy votes, that would be a different thing, but I don’t believe that’s mainly what’s going on here. Americans who belong to ALEC do so because they genuinely believe in the causes it promotes, not because they’re buying or selling votes.


This is yet another example, in other words, of the impressive and highly skillful ways that conservatives have built very carefully thought-out institutions to advocate for their interests over the past half century. Although there may be analogous structures at the other end of the political spectrum, they’re frequently not nearly so well coordinated or so disciplined in the ways they pursue their goals. (The nearest analog to ALEC that I’m aware of on the left is the Progressive States Network, whose website can be perused at

http://www.progressivestates.org/

but PSN was only founded in 2005, does not mainly focus on writing model legislation, and is not as well organized or as disciplined as ALEC.) To be fair, conservatives would probably argue that the liberal networks they oppose were so well woven into the fabric of government agencies, labor unions, universities, churches, and non-profit organizations that these liberal networks organize themselves and operate quite differently than conservative networks do–and conservatives would be able to able to muster valid evidence to support such an argument, however we might finally evaluate the persuasiveness of that evidence.


Again, I want anyone reading this post to understand that I am emphatically not questioning the legitimacy of advocacy networks in a democracy. To the contrary: I believe they are essential to democracy. My concern is rather to promote open public discussion and the genuine clash of opinions among different parts of the political spectrum, which I believe is best served by full and open disclosure of the interests of those who advocate particular policies.

That's right I have no objection what so ever that ALEC exists, or that they are very successful in getting legislation drafted and passed.


I just think more people in this nation should be aware of it as well. That way when someone like Scott Walker and the Wisconsin Republicans push thought some of the most dramatic and controversial legislation in their history people know that it actually comes from ALEC and is being proposed coast to coast.


But I also don't think we should pretend that ALEC is anything but a very powerful and successful machine for pushing the conservative agenda which as many or you know I consider a lie as it is preached and practiced.


And what is the proof of that statement. Well its their membership requirements for one thing.

Becoming a Member of ALEC: Not So Easy to Do

How do you become a member? Simple. Two ways. You can be an elected Republican legislator who, after being individually vetted, pays a token fee of roughly $100 per biennium to join. Here’s the membership brochure to use if you meet this criterion:
http://www.alec.org/AM/pdf/2011_legi...e_brochure.pdf
What if you’re not a Republican elected official? Not to worry. You can apply to join ALEC as a “private sector” member by paying at least a few thousand dollars depending on which legislative domains most interest you. Here’s the membership brochure if you meet this criterion:
http://www.alec.org/am/pdf/Corporate_Brochure.pdf
Then again, even if most of us had this kind of money to contribute to ALEC, I have a feeling that membership might not necessarily be open to just anyone who is willing to pay the fee. But maybe I’m being cynical here.


Which Wisconsin Republican politicians are members of ALEC? Good question. How would we know? ALEC doesn’t provide this information on its website unless you’re able to log in as a member. Maybe we need to ask our representatives. One might think that Republican legislators gathered at a national ALEC meeting could be sufficiently numerous to trigger the “walking quorum rule” that makes it illegal for public officials in Wisconsin to meet unannounced without public notice of their meeting. But they’re able to avoid this rule (which applies to every other public body in Wisconsin) because they’re protected by a loophole in what is otherwise one of the strictest open meetings laws in the nation. The Wisconsin legislature carved out a unique exemption from that law for its own party caucuses, Democrats and Republicans alike. So Wisconsin Republicans are able to hold secret meetings with ALEC to plan their legislative strategies whenever they want, safe in the knowledge that no one will be able to watch while they do so.

(See http://www.doj.state.wi.us/dls/OMPR/...ance_Guide.pdf for a full discussion of Wisconsin’s otherwise very strict Open Meetings Law.)


If it has seemed to you while watching recent debates in the legislature that many Republican members of the Senate and Assembly have already made up their minds about the bills on which they’re voting, and don’t have much interest in listening to arguments being made by anyone else in the room, it’s probably because they did in fact make up their minds about these bills long before they entered the Capitol chambers. You can decide for yourself whether that’s a good expression of the “sifting and winnowing” for which this state long ago became famous.

http://scholarcitizen.williamcronon....11/03/15/alec/


Yes I think getting to know more about ALEC and what they are proposing and who they are backing is a very important part of understanding our political system better and exposing who's really pulling the strings.

Originally Posted by ace's n 8's

Frightening???fuck they are not frightening,,nothing like some shit that I have seen, like ACORN, George Soros, Steven Chu and Obama with his unlimited Czars.

I'll deeply thank you for bringing ALEC to the light, now I know someone is on my side,,,FINALLY. The thought of an organization that has my views of limited government....Hell I'm even going to put their site right up on my toolbar.

Its the idea of conservative groups pushing for more for-profit, private prisons is frightening enough to me Ace when we already imprison more people than any other nation on earth and judges are willing to put kids in prison for kickbacks.

'Kids for cash' judge sentenced to 28 years for racketeering scheme

A Pennsylvania judge was sentenced Thursday for his part in what prosecutors called a 'kids for cash' scheme that sent juvenile offenders to privately run detention facilities in return for kickbacks


http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice...teering-scheme

[ace's n 8's]

[QUOTE=stumbler;4331852]

Its the idea of conservative groups pushing for more for-profit, private prisons is frightening enough to me Ace when we already imprison more people than any other nation on earth and judges are willing to put kids in prison for kickbacks.

With a population of over 300 million, you'll find some bad,bad people in the mix, it's not like we can cut their right hand off, send them in for a stitch or two and smack their left hand and tell them it's next if you steal again. Fuck, we send them to jail/prison for a number of years, then the dumb mother fuckers get out and do stupid shit again. Life must be good on the inside.

'Kids for cash' judge sentenced to 28 years for racketeering scheme

A Pennsylvania judge was sentenced Thursday for his part in what prosecutors called a 'kids for cash' scheme that sent juvenile offenders to privately run detention facilities in return for kickbacks


http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice...teering-scheme

28 years for some extra ''going out to eat'' cash,,what a dumb ass judge. I dont know how you can justifiably condemn ALEC for the actions of an ''idiot above the law'' judge or two. Kids now a days have no respect or fear for authority, sometimes they need a good dose of real tough love. Now for the judge doing it for a ''kickback'',,I say throw the key away.

[McDick]

Originally Posted by stumbler

Its the idea of conservative groups pushing for more for-profit, private prisons is frightening enough to me Ace when we already imprison more people than any other nation on earth and judges are willing to put kids in prison for kickbacks.

'Kids for cash' judge sentenced to 28 years for racketeering scheme

A Pennsylvania judge was sentenced Thursday for his part in what prosecutors called a 'kids for cash' scheme that sent juvenile offenders to privately run detention facilities in return for kickbacks


http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice...teering-scheme

Judge Mark Ciavarella, the "Kids for Cash" judge sentenced to 28 years, ran for his position on the Democrat ticket.

[stumbler]

Originally Posted by ace's n 8's

With a population of over 300 million, you'll find some bad,bad people in the mix, it's not like we can cut their right hand off, send them in for a stitch or two and smack their left hand and tell them it's next if you steal again. Fuck, we send them to jail/prison for a number of years, then the dumb mother fuckers get out and do stupid shit again. Life must be good on the inside.
28 years for some extra ''going out to eat'' cash,,what a dumb ass judge. I dont know how you can justifiably condemn ALEC for the actions of an ''idiot above the law'' judge or two. Kids now a days have no respect or fear for authority, sometimes they need a good dose of real tough love. Now for the judge doing it for a ''kickback'',,I say throw the key away.

Really more people than in China for example?

And how's that working for us Ace?

Not to well in my opinion for sure.

http://forum.xnxx.com/showthread.php?t=29305

Supreme Court orders California to slash prison population by more than 30,000

In a 5-to-4 ruling, the Supreme Court says severe overcrowding in the prisons violates the Eighth Amendment ban on cruel and unusual punishment. A minority opinion offers a sharp dissent.


http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice...re-than-30-000

Originally Posted by McDick

Judge Mark Ciavarella, the "Kids for Cash" judge sentenced to 28 years, ran for his position on the Democrat ticket.

That does not matter to me because both sides have their share of corrupt people.

The point is there's no incentive to sentence innocent people to jail or prison when those institutions are run by the state. When there is every incentive to get as many people as possible behind bars in private for-profit prisons which adds to the incentive for corruption.

We just watched the US financial sector cause a world economic collapse and the Great Recession in the US through their own greed and corruption. That proves they should be in prisons not running them for profit.

And let's not forget we're actually talking about good old ALEC here and promoting prisons for profits is just one thing they're doing.

The also wrote the union busting bills Governor Scott Walker passed in Wisconsin as well as the new voter ID laws.

There's a lot more to explore here than just putting people in prison for profit.

[ace's n 8's]

[QUOTE=stumbler;4332091]

Really more people than in China for example?

And how's that working for us Ace?

Not to well in my opinion for sure.

http://forum.xnxx.com/showthread.php?t=29305

Supreme Court orders California to slash prison population by more than 30,000

In a 5-to-4 ruling, the Supreme Court says severe overcrowding in the prisons violates the Eighth Amendment ban on cruel and unusual punishment. A minority opinion offers a sharp dissent.


http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice...re-than-30-000

What the fuck does china have to do with our prison population. Let the supreme court release 10-15% of the prison population nation wide,,they'll be back in, in less than 2 years.

That does not matter to me because both sides have their share of corrupt people.

The point is there's no incentive to sentence innocent people to jail or prison when those institutions are run by the state. When there is every incentive to get as many people as possible behind bars in private for-profit prisons which adds to the incentive for corruption.

We just watched the US financial sector cause a world economic collapse and the Great Recession in the US through their own greed and corruption. That proves they should be in prisons not running them for profit.

And let's not forget we're actually talking about good old ALEC here and promoting prisons for profits is just one thing they're doing.

The also wrote the union busting bills Governor Scott Walker passed in Wisconsin as well as the new voter ID laws.

There's a lot more to explore here than just putting people in prison for profit.

BULLSHIT,,matter of fact,,,BULL-MOTHERFUCKIN- SHIT,,if he had been nominated under a republican,,it would have been in your second sentence.

[tenguy]

Originally Posted by stumbler

And let's not forget we're actually talking about good old ALEC here and promoting prisons for profits is just one thing they're doing.

The also wrote the union busting bills Governor Scott Walker passed in Wisconsin as well as the new voter ID laws.

There's a lot more to explore here than just putting people in prison for profit.

Paranoia becomes you as much as the bold pink text does. OMG, look at this, someone is trying to influence legislators, hurry get the women and children inside.

Who do you think actually writes legislation?

According to: http://www.govtrackinsider.com/artic...whowritesbills

It's lawyers who draft legislation (because they know the existing laws) and pass it by those parties who may be affected by the law, who then give their input and then the final draft is given to the potential sponsor.

ALEC is just one of many organizations who draft legislation.

Others include the ACLU, labor unions, special interest groups (Planned Parenthood, etc.) and ANYONE who is so inclined, even you can write a proposed law and submit it for sponsorship.

[stumbler]

Originally Posted by ace's n 8's

What the fuck does china have to do with our prison population. Let the supreme court release 10-15% of the prison population nation wide,,they'll be back in, in less than 2 years.
BULLSHIT,,matter of fact,,,BULL-MOTHERFUCKIN- SHIT,,if he had been nominated under a republican,,it would have been in your second sentence.

Well you lose that bullshit Ace because the judge's political affiliation never occurred to me. We don't elect judge's out here. And I've sure never been fool enough to claim that the liberal/progressive/Democrats don't have corrupt politicians or our share of criminals.

So you can suck on that one Ace.

But in the meantime I'm finding out lots of interesting things about ALEC and have to admit that's its pretty surprising I haven't really heard of them until just a month or two ago and the odds of that being a political coincidence that I'm just happening to be hearing about them now are beyond astronomical.

For instance I found this very handy site:

Get the Goods on ALEC

ALEC Exposed Audio & Video
From The Nation Magazine:
ALEC & Democracy
ALEC & Education
ALEC & Labor

ALEC & Health
ALEC & Koch
ALEC & Prisons (NEW!)
From PR Watch:
ALEC & Injury Law
ALEC & Wisconsin
ALEC & Tobacco
ALEC & Climate Change
From SourceWatch:
Press on ALEC Exposed
ALEC Quotes


http://www.alecexposed.org/wiki/ALEC_Exposed


Looks like ALEC has their fingers in just about everything doesn't it.


But I think that's about to become a lot better known.

[RandyKnight]

Originally Posted by tenguy

Frightening? Now I understand why you like to type in pink, bold letters. You are a sissy.

Here, instead of sitting there shaking in your boots reading about them on Huffy, why not read about ALEC on their "hidden" website.

http://www.alec.org/AM/Template.cfm?Section=Home

Yea well they have been around since 78 and they have only had a web page since 98...they were hiding before that...

[stumbler]

Originally Posted by RandyKnight

Yea well they have been around since 78 and they have only had a web page since 98...they were hiding before that...

You were aware of them before this?

[ace's n 8's]

[QUOTE=stumbler;4332179]

Well you lose that bullshit Ace because the judge's political affiliation never occurred to me. We don't elect judge's out here. And I've sure never been fool enough to claim that the liberal/progressive/Democrats don't have corrupt politicians or our share of criminals.

I have found that the crooked leftist politicians generally get a Governors pardon from you, or you tend to alter the discussion to take the focus off of the leftists political criminals,,like the thread ''MORE REPUBLICAN HILARITY''

But in the meantime I'm finding out lots of interesting things about ALEC and have to admit that's its pretty surprising I haven't really heard of them until just a month or two ago and the odds of that being a political coincidence that I'm just happening to be hearing about them now are beyond astronomical.

For instance I found this very handy site:

Get the Goods on ALEC

ALEC Exposed Audio & Video
From The Nation Magazine:
ALEC & Democracy
ALEC & Education
ALEC & Labor

ALEC & Health
ALEC & Koch
ALEC & Prisons (NEW!)
From PR Watch:
ALEC & Injury Law
ALEC & Wisconsin
ALEC & Tobacco
ALEC & Climate Change
From SourceWatch:
Press on ALEC Exposed
ALEC Quotes


http://www.alecexposed.org/wiki/ALEC_Exposed


Looks like ALEC has their fingers in just about everything doesn't it.


But I think that's about to become a lot better known.

Quite the busy beaver today, if they were linked to the ACLU or George Soros, you certainly wouldn't invest your precious time into the research. How do you say that,,,'' hysterical old grandma''

[stumbler]

Originally Posted by ace's n 8's

I have found that the crooked leftist politicians generally get a Governors pardon from you, or you tend to alter the discussion to take the focus off of the leftists political criminals,,like the thread ''MORE REPUBLICAN HILARITY''

Well non-fuck you Ace I'm not going to do your work for you. If you want a MORE DEMOCRATIC HILARITY/HYPOCRISY thread you can just get off your own personal ass and do it yourself.

I admitted I was a progressive/liberal/Democrat partisan and fighter against the lie of conservatism as it is preached and practiced since I first got on this forum.

So you get off your ass and rake your own muck. Don't expect me to do it for you.

Originally Posted by ace's n 8's

Quite the busy beaver today, if they were linked to the ACLU or George Soros, you certainly wouldn't invest your precious time into the research. How do you say that,,,'' hysterical old grandma''

And thanks for reminding me Ace. I got one more too.

[RandyKnight]

yep The rights answer to the ACLU...the silent majority....yep and my Granddad was on one board that was called Christians for a Moral Society...I think...that was the name....

But hell I was a member of the SDS once upon a time....

Like Abbey Hoffman said......the fight is over go home take care of your family cause this country is going to crumble from the inside out.....in his book....War for the Hell of It.

[stumbler]

Originally Posted by RandyKnight

yep The rights answer to the ACLU...the silent majority....yep and my Granddad was on one board that was called Christians for a Moral Society...I think...that was the name....

But hell I was a member of the SDS once upon a time....

Like Abbey Hoffman said......the fight is over go home take care of your family cause this country is going to crumble from the inside out.....in his book....War for the Hell of It.

Abbey never took his own advice. He died (or was killed) right after helping to expose the Ronald Reagan Presidential Campaign's roll in keeping the Iranian hostages held until after the presidential election.

And I really disagree. I've never seen the battle between the lie of conservatism and liberalism come to a more critical battle at a more divergent time in our history.

This is a time to join the fray instead of sit there and just take what's handed to you it seems to me.

[RandyKnight]

Well posting on this board is not getting into the Fray as you say....

I do not like what is going on but I took it the streets once before...

If this generation was anything like mine we would have stopped this stupid war by now....that would save a bunch of money

Thought Obama was gonna get us out not deeper..he riding around in a bus belly aching when he needs to sit his Black ass down in the White House and work something out but now that he has his money he is off and running for president again.

[stumbler]

Originally Posted by RandyKnight

Well posting on this board is not getting into the Fray as you say....

I do not like what is going on but I took it the streets once before...

If this generation was anything like mine we would have stopped this stupid war by now....that would save a bunch of money

Thought Obama was gonna get us out not deeper..he riding around in a bus belly aching when he needs to sit his Black ass down in the White House and work something out but now that he has his money he is off and running for president again.

Really?? Work what out? Tell me that. Tell me what President Obama can do that congress will approve.

And then keep pretending that President Obama is not drawing down troops in both Iraq and Afghanistan.

By all means keep pretending.

Me I'm going to keep on fighting for the things I believe in while I go otherwise happy through this life.

[tenguy]

Originally Posted by RandyKnight

Yea well they have been around since 78 and they have only had a web page since 98...they were hiding before that...

Yeppers, 13 years that website just lurked in the fringes. And obviously, if you didn't happen to know about them, they must be a clandestine rogue operation.

[ThisFNG]

Wow! You're a big 'fraidy-cat aren't you?

You skip the group's site. . . and dive into the propaganda sites like a drunk blond into the back seat when the car door closes.

You really have no idea who these think tanks are that you love to quote do you ?

[ace's n 8's]

[QUOTE=stumbler;4332291]

Well non-fuck you Ace I'm not going to do your work for you. If you want a MORE DEMOCRATIC HILARITY/HYPOCRISY thread you can just get off your own personal ass and do it yourself.

I admitted I was a progressive/liberal/Democrat partisan and fighter against the lie of conservatism as it is preached and practiced since I first got on this forum.

So you get off your ass and rake your own muck. Don't expect me to do it for you.

Nah,, it's a waste of my time,, I have much better things that need to be accomplished. You just keep one fighting the good fight and do your posting from the leftist blogs and media, bashing the right.

And thanks for reminding me Ace. I got one more too.

Bring it daddy-O.

[Druidoak]

Though you and I do not usually see eye to eye, I have to say good find to the info on ALEC.

I dled some of the zip files, I have to say everyone in the country needs to see this information.

The members of ALEC reads like a who's who of Big Corporate America and it is also the list of all the major contributors to the Republican party. The list of legislators for Ohio that are members of ALEC include all the setting Republicans and one loan Democrat.

The two bills out of 800 I think was the number, that I have looked at have already raised red flags.

One is making Hearsay evidence legal and the other one dealt with revising Obsenity and Child porn.

The Child Porn is always a hot button but the Obsenity and Pornography part of the bill would open the door to banning all porn.

[tenguy]

Originally Posted by stumbler

You were aware of them before this?

Were you aware of the ACLU or Planned Parenthood, how about the AFL/CIO?

[stumbler]

Originally Posted by ThisFNG

Wow! You're a big 'fraidy-cat aren't you?

You skip the group's site. . . and dive into the propaganda sites like a drunk blond into the back seat when the car door closes.

You really have no idea who these think tanks are that you love to quote do you ?

WOW!!! YOU'RE A LYING NON-FUCKER AREN'T YOU????

I've been all over ALEC's site. But got no inclination what so ever to promote it. Its a lot better for my time to get the word out and prove you a phony fuck in that process.

Originally Posted by ace's n 8's

]Nah,, it's a waste of my time,, I have much better things that need to be accomplished. You just keep one fighting the good fight and do your posting from the leftist blogs and media, bashing the right.



Bring it daddy-O.

Ace I'll just point out to you once again that you spend an awful lot of time "not looking at things."

And that's the problem but bring it I will.

Originally Posted by Druidoak

Though you and I do not usually see eye to eye, I have to say good find to the info on ALEC.

I dled some of the zip files, I have to say everyone in the country needs to see this information.

The members of ALEC reads like a who's who of Big Corporate America and it is also the list of all the major contributors to the Republican party. The list of legislators for Ohio that are members of ALEC include all the setting Republicans and one loan Democrat.

The two bills out of 800 I think was the number, that I have looked at have already raised red flags.

One is making Hearsay evidence legal and the other one dealt with revising Obsenity and Child porn.

The Child Porn is always a hot button but the Obsenity and Pornography part of the bill would open the door to banning all porn.

[ace's n 8's]

[QUOTE=stumbler;4332764]

Ace I'll just point out to you once again that you spend an awful lot of time "not looking at things."

And that's the problem but bring it I will.

Listen up you impotent bitch,, there are more important things to ''not look up'', just like this.

http://forum.xnxx.com/showthread.php?t=232904

[ThisFNG]

Again. . . pfft.

All you reference it propagandist blogs. You don't seem to grasp basic language either. When all your references are slued and psychotically left, you don't just get to call me 'liar liar pants on fire'. Your arguments are puerile and pusillanimous.

Here, since you're a moron, I'll help you look those up, and yes they are used correctly unlike your usage of calling me a liar. . .

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/puerile

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/pusillanimous

Originally Posted by stumbler

WOW!!! YOU'RE A LYING NON-FUCKER AREN'T YOU????

I've been all over ALEC's site. But got no inclination what so ever to promote it. Its a lot better for my time to get the word out and prove you a phony fuck in that process.

[stumbler]

Originally Posted by ace's n 8's

Listen up you impotent bitch,, there are more important things to ''not look up'', just like this.

http://forum.xnxx.com/showthread.php?t=232904

Ace, buddy and friend, I won't even take a cheap shot on this. But it reference to reality you accidentally linked this site.

I won't even fuck with you over it. "Overs." Its cool.

[stumbler]

Originally Posted by ThisFNG

Again. . . pfft.

All you reference it propagandist blogs. You don't seem to grasp basic language either. When all your references are slued and psychotically left, you don't just get to call me 'liar liar pants on fire'. Your arguments are puerile and pusillanimous.

Here, since you're a moron, I'll help you look those up, and yes they are used correctly unlike your usage of calling me a liar. . .

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/puerile

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/pusillanimous

You go ahead and pursue and peruse children if you want. *alert to modes and admin* and cowardice, which is the next thing to being human as being alive, if you want to.

You go ahead and knock yourself out. Because I'm pretty sure you don't exist in a tangible form in the first place.

[stumbler]

Originally Posted by ThisFNG

Again. . . pfft.

All you reference it propagandist blogs. You don't seem to grasp basic language either. When all your references are slued and psychotically left, you don't just get to call me 'liar liar pants on fire'. Your arguments are puerile and pusillanimous.

Here, since you're a moron, I'll help you look those up, and yes they are used correctly unlike your usage of calling me a liar. . .

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/puerile

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/pusillanimous

Wait, wait, I almost forgot. What did you say the rate of inflation is about a couple months ago?

Come on. Let's take another lood at that "formula" of yours and see how its working out?

What do you say? You weren't just bullshitting were you?

[Empress Lainie]

It is apparently just like I have said many times......we have a de facto FASCIST government, where the corporations control everything; and for "corporations" it is actually the wealthiest people who control the corporations, not the majority of people who are the stockholders.

[tenguy]

Originally Posted by stumbler

Wait, wait, I almost forgot. What did you say the rate of inflation is about a couple months ago?

Come on. Let's take another lood at that "formula" of yours and see how its working out?

What do you say? You weren't just bullshitting were you?

[stumbler]

Originally Posted by Druidoak

Though you and I do not usually see eye to eye, I have to say good find to the info on ALEC.

I dled some of the zip files, I have to say everyone in the country needs to see this information.

The members of ALEC reads like a who's who of Big Corporate America and it is also the list of all the major contributors to the Republican party. The list of legislators for Ohio that are members of ALEC include all the setting Republicans and one loan Democrat.

The two bills out of 800 I think was the number, that I have looked at have already raised red flags.

One is making Hearsay evidence legal and the other one dealt with revising Obsenity and Child porn.

The Child Porn is always a hot button but the Obsenity and Pornography part of the bill would open the door to banning all porn.

Opps. I apologize for quoting this and not respond to it.

But like you I'm not really used to agreeing.

I had a funny experience when a buddy of mine came to me because his kid had been busted and I suddenly found out that nothing I knew about the law or even constitution applied if it was the Feds and RICCO.

This guy could have dropped a quarter million on defense and could not find a lawyer to take it because it was the feds. And that's all she was nailed on. Not what she really did, but what people said she did. Hell the people who were really in the business at least had people to rat out. All she could say was yes she and her husband did meth and he knew some people.

She goes to prison and he ends up quietly walking is what really happens.

[ace's n 8's]

Originally Posted by tenguy

LOL,, FUCK ME

[ThisFNG]

Originally Posted by stumbler

You go ahead and pursue and peruse children if you want. *alert to modes and admin* and cowardice, which is the next thing to being human as being alive, if you want to.

You go ahead and knock yourself out. Because I'm pretty sure you don't exist in a tangible form in the first place.

Wow, your dumb! You can't even use a dictionary.

Just for you since you're so cute when you're angry, when I call YOU 'petulant', that means I am saying YOU are behaving like a 'spoiled child'. . . and since you list your age as 59 (or whatever you claim) that means if I call you a child. . . . [drum roll] . . . it's an insult because you are supposed to possess a modicum of maturity. . .

[ThisFNG]

Have you checked gas prices lately? How about food prices? Both going up but are not included in the posted numbers due to 'volatility'.

Have you been watching the FED? Get your head out of your third point of contact and actually read what I posted about inflation and what I said the FED would need to do to avert it. I said they had THREE tools and two of them are nearly exhausted. I guess you missed that part where I said the increased reserve rate for the banks was one of the last recourses available to the FED to avert inflation. I also said that it was many orders of effect away. . .

Mathematically the problems still exist. Inflation will manifest in either higher prices or decreased availability of goods caused by price controls.

Originally Posted by stumbler

Wait, wait, I almost forgot. What did you say the rate of inflation is about a couple months ago?

Come on. Let's take another lood at that "formula" of yours and see how its working out?

What do you say? You weren't just bullshitting were you?

[ace's n 8's]

Originally Posted by ThisFNG

Have you checked gas prices lately? How about food prices? Both going up but are not included in the posted numbers due to 'volatility'.

Have you been watching the FED? Get your head out of your third point of contact and actually read what I posted about inflation and what I said the FED would need to do to avert it. I said they had THREE tools and two of them are nearly exhausted. I guess you missed that part where I said the increased reserve rate for the banks was one of the last recourses available to the FED to avert inflation. I also said that it was many orders of effect away. . .

Mathematically the problems still exist. Inflation will manifest in either higher prices or decreased availability of goods caused by price controls.

Economics is NOT my strong suit, so the question is,, is there a threat of hyper-inflation?

[stumbler]

Originally Posted by ThisFNG

Have you checked gas prices lately? How about food prices? Both going up but are not included in the posted numbers due to 'volatility'.

Have you been watching the FED? Get your head out of your third point of contact and actually read what I posted about inflation and what I said the FED would need to do to avert it. I said they had THREE tools and two of them are nearly exhausted. I guess you missed that part where I said the increased reserve rate for the banks was one of the last recourses available to the FED to avert inflation. I also said that it was many orders of effect away. . .

Mathematically the problems still exist. Inflation will manifest in either higher prices or decreased availability of goods caused by price controls.

Yes I have and they are going down so I guess I don't have to got further than that to prove what a phony fool you really are do I?

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-f...,3506610.story

[stumbler]

Well guess what? Here's a story that says not everyone gets to meet the real ALEC (lobbyist). And I think that's against the law.

VIDEO: Corporate Lobbyist Concedes He Does Not Always Register As A Lobbyist For ALEC Bills He Helps Write

FANG: But ALEC is a very convenient identity. The person could say ‘I’m a Jeffersonian individual liberty, you know conservative, I’m not here representing Phillip Morris or whatever.’ It’s a front, that’s the accusation and you haven’t really deflected that.


SCHWARTZ: Well all the people, all the people who sponsor ALEC on the webs and everything say these are the people who sponsor and if in my experience when I’ve testified – I don’t do it too much – if someone is there, they will say well Victor is representing ALEC. And everyone knows who sponsors ALEC, General Motors and everything, and they list them.

http://thinkprogress.org/politics/20...st-disclosure/

[stumbler]

I just wanted to check and see if anyone has seen ALEC's name mentioned lately. Because I sure have.

ALEC is credited with drafting both the Union Busting laws and the new voter ID laws. They are also now being credited with writing most our "get tough on crime laws."

And that's good because I'm convinced that the reason ALEC has been so successful at pushing their conservative agenda is because hardly anyone outside the conservative/Republican/Tea Party knew they existed or were responsible for so many laws. That was their greatest asset.

But they've lost that advantage now and are becoming more famous by the day.

Also I can't wait to get into a public meeting where I can ask some of my elected GOP Senators and representatives, or major corporations why they can join ALEC but I can't.

No matter how conservative/Republican/Tea Party this state is that shit don't sit too good with the vast majority of us. First, because we actually and accidentally do believe in equality. And secondly because we are supposed to be as independent as rattlesnakes out here and taking marching orders from some politically elite group just doesn't sit well with us.

[ace's n 8's]

Originally Posted by stumbler

I just wanted to check and see if anyone has seen ALEC's name mentioned lately. Because I sure have.

ALEC is credited with drafting both the Union Busting laws and the new voter ID laws. They are also now being credited with writing most our "get tough on crime laws."

And that's good because I'm convinced that the reason ALEC has been so successful at pushing their conservative agenda is because hardly anyone outside the conservative/Republican/Tea Party knew they existed or were responsible for so many laws. That was their greatest asset.

But they've lost that advantage now and are becoming more famous by the day.

Also I can't wait to get into a public meeting where I can ask some of my elected GOP Senators and representatives, or major corporations why they can join ALEC but I can't.

No matter how conservative/Republican/Tea Party this state is that shit don't sit too good with the vast majority of us. First, because we actually and accidentally do believe in equality. And secondly because we are supposed to be as independent as rattlesnakes out here and taking marching orders from some politically elite group just doesn't sit well with us.

That's absolutely fabulous...Keep up the good work fella,,keep me posted on the newest and latest assignments that ALEC is focusing on.


Oh shit,,hey stumbler,, I almost forgot,,,check this out;

http://web.gbtv.com/index.jsp

[stumbler]

Originally Posted by ace's n 8's

That's absolutely fabulous...Keep up the good work fella,,keep me posted on the newest and latest assignments that ALEC is focusing on.


Oh shit,,hey stumbler,, I almost forgot,,,check this out;

http://web.gbtv.com/index.jsp

Yeah you got me on that one. I was going to ask if anyone knew what Glenn Beck was doing now just wondering if anyone knew he had is own website.

Its pretty shaky though I think even with his friends at Fox trying to pimp for him. And yes I did laugh my ass off at his outrageous lies.

On Fox, Beck Claims "Somebody" Says His Prediction "Accuracy Rate" Is 92%

Of course, Beck has a long history of making failed, outrageous, and baseless predictions. Previously:
Glenn Beck's Top 5 Failed Predictions
Beck Predicts New Muslim Caliphate Will "Control The Mideast And Parts Of Europe"
Beck Predicts "Race Riots" In U.S., "Fueled By The Media And By Our Politicians"
Beck stokes fears about inflation: "On November 3, the Fed hits the Weimar moment"
Beck Predicts That We May Lose "Israel And ... The Free World" This Summer
Beck predicts Stewart and Colbert will "go the way of Oprah" because "the American people are done with it"

http://mediamatters.org/blog/201109130011

PS And the fact that you're apparently the only one who knows what Beck is doing around here is not a good sign for his ratings Ace. Just sayin'.

[Empress Lainie]

Alec is my grandson but he is too young to be on this site. Sorry!

[ace's n 8's]

Originally Posted by stumbler

Yeah you got me on that one. I was going to ask if anyone knew what Glenn Beck was doing now just wondering if anyone knew he had is own website.

Its pretty shaky though I think even with his friends at Fox trying to pimp for him. And yes I did laugh my ass off at his outrageous lies.

On Fox, Beck Claims "Somebody" Says His Prediction "Accuracy Rate" Is 92%



http://mediamatters.org/blog/201109130011

PS And the fact that you're apparently the only one who knows what Beck is doing around here is not a good sign for his ratings Ace. Just sayin'.

[stumbler]

Ok so let's take a look at an ALEC political position and how that position is then translated to conservative/Republican/Tea Party dominated legislatures.

ALEC Approves a Resolution in Support of the Electoral College
Opposes National Popular Vote Legislation

http://www.alec.org/am/pdf/Electoral_College_PR.pdf

And now let's take a look at how that position actually plays out.

The GOP's Genius Plan to Beat Obama in 2012

Republican state legislators in Pennsylvania are pushing a scheme that, if GOPers in other states follow their lead, could cause President Barack Obama to lose the 2012 election—not because of the vote count, but because of new rules. That's not all: there's no legal way for Democrats to stop them.


The problem for Obama, and the opportunity for Republicans, is the electoral college. Every political junkie knows that the presidential election isn't a truly national contest; it's a state-by-state fight, and each state is worth a number of electoral votes equal to the size of the state's congressional delegation. (The District of Columbia also gets three votes.) There are 538 electoral votes up for grabs; win 270, and you're the president.


Here's the rub, though: Each state gets to determine how its electoral votes are allocated. Currently, 48 states and DC use a winner-take-all system in which the candidate who wins the popular vote in the state gets all of its electoral votes. Under the Republican plan—which has been endorsed by top Republicans in both houses of the state's legislature, as well as the governor, Tom Corbett—Pennsylvania would change from this system to one where each congressional district gets its own electoral vote. (Two electoral votes—one for each of the state's two senators—would go to the statewide winner.)

http://motherjones.com/politics/2011...eat-obama-2012


Pretty slick and it might just work. But I'll just have to believe that it won't once people figure out how ALEC and the conservative/Republican/Tea Baggers are trying to nullify their vote and simply dictate winners.

[tenguy]

Originally Posted by stumbler

Ok so let's take a look at an ALEC political position and how that position is then translated to conservative/Republican/Tea Party dominated legislatures.

ALEC Approves a Resolution in Support of the Electoral College
Opposes National Popular Vote Legislation

http://www.alec.org/am/pdf/Electoral_College_PR.pdf

And now let's take a look at how that position actually plays out.

The GOP's Genius Plan to Beat Obama in 2012




http://motherjones.com/politics/2011...eat-obama-2012


Pretty slick and it might just work. But I'll just have to believe that it won't once people figure out how ALEC and the conservative/Republican/Tea Baggers are trying to nullify their vote and simply dictate winners.

How did ALEC approve anything?

But you do have to admit that ALEC is one smart fella.

[stumbler]

I just thought its significant that I don't think I'm the only one who wants to introduce the American Public to ALEC.

In his essay Goodbye To All That Mike Lofgren also introduces his readers to ALEC.

[1] I am not exaggerating for effect. A law passed in 2010 by the Arizona legislature mandating arrest and incarceration of suspected illegal aliens was actually drafted by the American Legislative Exchange Council, a conservative business front group that drafts "model" legislation on behalf of its corporate sponsors. The draft legislation in question was written for the private prison lobby, which sensed a growth opportunity in imprisoning more people.

http://www.truth-out.org/goodbye-all...lt/1314907779#[1]

[stumbler]

Yeah, why didn't I think of that.

First you invent a private prison industry and pass lots of laws to get non-violent people thrown in prison for longer times. Better for business you know.

Then once you get enough of them in jail pass laws allowing businesses to use prison/slave labor to put even more Americans out of a job and increase profits.

That ALEC sure is a good group ain't they?

Conservative legislation mill a driving force behind private prisons


The private industry group ALEC, which creates form legislation that’s been copied and passed by Republicans in numerous states, has been a driving force behind the rise of the private prison industry in America.



This brief legislative analysis, by Main Street Insider, explains how that came to be and what ALEC’s legislation actually does.


This video is from Main Street Insider, published Sept. 19, 2011.

http://www.rawstory.com/rawreplay/20...ivate-prisons/

[stumbler]

And how's the end result drafting model legislation to help the private prison industry working out?

U.S. Private Prison Population Grew 37 Percent Between 2002-2009 As Industry Lobbying Dollars Grew 165 Percent



http://thinkprogress.org/justice/201...tion-lobbying/

[tenguy]

Originally Posted by stumbler

And how's the end result drafting model legislation to help the private prison industry working out?

U.S. Private Prison Population Grew 37 Percent Between 2002-2009 As Industry Lobbying Dollars Grew 165 Percent



http://thinkprogress.org/justice/201...tion-lobbying/

I guess that it being an idea whose time has come, is beyond your grasp.

[stumbler]

Hey what do you know ALEC has hands across the water and they apparently just got caught in the cookie jar.

As Scandal Engulfs American Legislative Exchange Council’s U.K. Affiliate, A Closer Look At Its US Operation

The Atlantic Bridge, the British affiliate organization to the American Legislative Exchange Council, is quickly erupting into a scandal that may force the public to scrutinize the practices of both right-wing groups. Earlier this month, the U.K.’s Charity Commission shut down Atlantic Bridge after an investigation revealed that the nonprofit has operated as little more than a front for various corporate lobbying and Tory party interests. The scandal has already forced the resignation of David Cameron’s Defense Secretary Liam Fox after the revelation that the Atlantic Bridge’s London-based director, Adam Werritty, had improperly acted as a high level advisor to Fox while employed by a number of military industry and lobbying clients.

http://thinkprogress.org/politics/20...-alec-exposed/