BASEBALL SEASON 2012

[justpassingthru]

Originally Posted by richief

Okay, this may seem naive to all you Americans and Canadians but as I watch the games the commentators keep referring to stats and terms that lose me.

ERA, I know it is earned runs average, but what is an earned run.

OPS

WRISP

and all the other stats that they talk of, I like the game of baseball but get lost when they use these terms.

Thanks in advance.

Stick to the simple one's as they can get very technical.

Glossary: Baseball Prospectus Exclusive


1-day

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The 1-day injury risk is a part of the CHIPPER injury projection system. It assesses how likely it is that a player will miss one or more days due to injury.
Associated colors represent the probability of risk: green for low probability, yellow for moderate, and red for high.

15-days

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The 15-day injury risk is a part of the CHIPPER injury projection system. It assesses how likely it is that a player will miss 15 or more days due to injury.
Associated colors represent the probability of risk: green for low probability, yellow for moderate, and red for high.

EqBRR

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Base Running Runs. Measures the number of runs contributed by a player's advancement on the bases, above what would be expected based on the number and quality of the baserunning opportunities with which the player is presented, park-adjusted and based on a multi-year run expectancy table. BRR is calculated as the sum of various baserunning components: Ground Advancement Runs (GAR), Stolen Base Runs (SBR), Air Advancement Runs (AAR), Hit Advancement Runs (HAR) and Other Advancement Runs (OAR).
Here is an example of the Base Running Runs spectrum based on the 2011 season:
Excellent – Ian Kinsler 11.6
Great – Coco Crisp 4.3
Average – Bobby Abreu 0.0
Poor – Casey Kotchman -4.4
Horrendous – Ryan Howard -9.4

FIP

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FIP is a component ERA inspired by the work of Voros McCracken on defense-indepdendent pitching statistics, but has become more widely used because of the ease of computation - it requires only four easily-found box score stats, uses only basic arithmetic operations and has four easily-memorized constants. It was conceived of by both Tom Tango and Clay Dreslough, the latter of who called it Defense-Independent Component ERA.
At Prospectus, we are including hit batters in the walks term. The constant we use is both league and season specific - in other words, a pitcher in the American League will have a different FIP constant than a pitcher in the National League. This differs from the presentation of FIP on sites such as Fangraphs, which use one constant for both leagues in each season.
Here is an example of the Fielding Independent Pitching spectrum based on the 2011 season:
Excellent – Roy Halladay 2.17
Great – David Price 3.36
Average – Tim Stauffer 4.00
Poor – Carlos Zambrano 4.56
Horrendous – Bronson Arroyo 5.68

FRA

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Fair Run Average differs from FIP in a few ways. While FIP is concerned only with what a pitcher is believed to control—typically strikeouts, walks, and home runs, though Prospectus includes hit batsmen in our FIP calculation—Fair Run Average takes things a step further. Pitchers receive credit for good sequencing, thus rewarding pitchers who seem to work out of jams more often than usual. Fair Run Average also considers batted ball distribution, base-out state, and team defensive quality (as measured by Fielding Runs Above Average).
Here is an example of the Fair Run Average spectrum based on the 2011 season:
Excellent – Clayton Kershaw 2.90
Great – Brandon McCarthy 3.42
Average – Ivan Nova 4.36
Poor – Brett Cecil 5.14
Horrendous – Jake Arrieta 5.88

FRAA

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The biggest difference between Fielding Runs Above Average and similar defensive metrics comes in the data and philosophy used. Whereas other metrics use zone-based fielding data, Fielding Runs Above Average ignores that data due to the numerous biases present. Fielding Runs Above Average instead focuses on play-by-play data, taking a step back and focusing on the number of plays made compared to the average number of plays made by a player at said position. The pitcher’s groundball tendencies, batter handedness, park, and base-out state all go into figuring out how many plays an average player at a position would make.
Here is an example of the Fielding Runs Above Average spectrum based upon the 2011 season—for the sake of consistency, the players featured below all play the same position (center field):
Excellent – Jacoby Ellsbury 11.6
Great – Nyjer Morgan 5.5
Average – Marlon Byrd 0.6
Poor – Roger Bernadina -5.2
Horrendous – Melky Cabrera -13.2


JAWS

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Abbreviation for "Jaffe WARP Score." System invented by Jay Jaffe to assess a player's worthiness for enshrinement in the Hall of Fame. Equal to the average of a player's peak WARP and total career WARP. Jaffe used the system before, but the term was coined here.
The methodology is explained in full here.

JAWS Methodology

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A player's JAWS score is the average of his career WARP total and his peak total [(Career WARP + Peak WARP) / 2], where Peak is a player's best seven seasons (early versions of the system used best five consecutive, but this method was abandoned starting with the 2006 BBWAA ballot). This JAWS score is then compared to a modified average of the enshrined Hall of Famers at each position, with the lowest score—invariably an unqualified Veterans Committee selection—dropped (four pitchers are dropped).
Because the WARP data undergoes minor tweaks from time to time, JAWS standards at each position need occasional re-computation. The standards for the 2011 BBWAA ballot are:
POS WARP Peak JAWS C 51.7 33.9 42.9 1B 61.1 40.8 51.6 2B 64.7 43.2 54.0 3B 68.6 45.3 55.5 SS 60.6 40.3 50.8 LF 65.1 42.0 53.6 CF 72.8 46.8 58.5 RF 66.2 40.9 53.6 SP 51.1 36.0 43.5 RP 29.1 17.5 23.3
OPP_QUAL_TAV

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Opponent's Quality, True Average -- the aggregate True Average of all batters faced (by a pitcher), or allowed by all pitchers faced (for a batter).

PADE

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Based off of Bill James' Defensive Efficiency idea, PADE calculates how well a team performed on defense, while adjusting for their park environments. Certain parks make it easier for the defense to turn a ball in play into an out and this adjusts for that fact.
Introduced by James Click here and updated by Click here.
Here is an example of the Park-Adjusted Defensive Efficiency spectrum based on the 2011 season:
Excellent – Tampa Bay 4.30
Great – Los Angeles of Anaheim 1.47
Average – Atlanta -0.02
Poor – Chicago (A) -1.41
Horrendous – Minnesota -2.41


PECOTA

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Stands for Player Empirical Comparison and Optimization Test Algorithm. PECOTA is BP's proprietary system that projects player performance based on comparison with historical player-seasons. There are three elements to PECOTA:
1) Major-league equivalencies, to allow us to use minor-league stats to project how a player will perform in the majors;
2) Baseline forecasts, which use weighted averages and regression to the mean to produce an estimate of a player’s true talent level;
3) A career-path adjustment, which incorporates information about how comparable players’ stats changed over time.
Check out the PECOTA section of the glossary for more on the system's intricacies.

TAv

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True Average incorporates aspects that other linear weights-based metrics ignore. Reaching base on an error and situational hitting are included; meanwhile, strikeouts and bunts are treated as slightly more and less damaging outs than normal. The baseline for an average player is not meant to portray what a typical player has done, but rather what a typical player would do if given similar opportunities. That means adjustments made for parks and league quality. True Average’s adjustments go beyond applying a blanket modifier—players who play more home games than road games will see that reflected in their adjustments. Unlike its predecessor, Equivalent Average, True Average does not consider baserunning or basestealing.
Here is an example of the True Average spectrum based upon the 2009-2011 seasons:
Excellent – Miguel Cabrera .342
Great – Alex Rodriguez .300
Average – Austin Jackson .260
Poor – Ronny Cedeno .228
Horrendous – Brandon Wood .192

TAv_Against

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True Average Against is to True Average what Batting Average Against is to Batting Average. In other words, True Average Against will tell you how well opposing batters have hit a pitcher. Do note that while True Average Against takes the pitcher’s park, league, and situational-based hitting into account, it does not exclude data where the pitcher faced an opposing pitcher. Because of that, National League pitchers should possess lower True Average Against than their American League counterparts.

VORP

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Value Over Replacement Player. The number of runs contributed beyond what a replacement-level player at the same position would contribute if given the same percentage of team plate appearances. VORP scores do not consider the quality of a player's defense.
Here is an example of the Value Over Replacement Player spectrum based on the 2011 season:
Excellent – Matt Kemp 95.2
Great – Robinson Cano 51.4
Average – Eric Hosmer 19.9
Poor – Derrek Lee 3.2
Horrendous – Adam Dunn -22.6


WARP

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Perhaps no sabermetric theory is more abstract than that of the replacement-level player. Essentially, replacement-level players are of a caliber so low that they are always available in the minor leagues because the players are well below major-league average. Prospectus’ definition of replacement level contends that a team full of such players would win a little over 50 games. This is a notable increase in replacement level from previous editions of Wins Above Replacement Player.
Here is an example of the Wins Above Replacement Player spectrum based on the 2011 season:
Excellent – Jose Bautista 10.3
Great – Hunter Pence 5.2
Average –Gaby Sanchez 2.0
Poor – Adam Lind 0.5
Horrendous – Adam Dunn -1.7

[justpassingthru]

The AL east and NL east are still the divisions that are the tightest and Toronto (29-26) is only 2.0 games back of leading Baltimore (31-24) in the AL east.

Texas (33-23) is nearly running away with the AL west currently.

[richief]

That as only confused me further, I am just about getting ERA and the in-field fly ball rule. I get the sacrifice moves to advance a runner, and understand the slugging percentage, damn this is a fun game to watch but I think it is over analysed at times.

Saw a bit of the Women's SB today, for some reason I did not like it, maybe it is the style of pitching but it seems to be diluted baseball.

[justpassingthru]

Originally Posted by richief

That as only confused me further, I am just about getting ERA and the in-field fly ball rule. I get the sacrifice moves to advance a runner, and understand the slugging percentage, damn this is a fun game to watch but I think it is over analysed at times.

Saw a bit of the Women's SB today, for some reason I did not like it, maybe it is the style of pitching but it seems to be diluted baseball.

I agree that it can be "over analysed" at times but it really is a technical game that is likened to a good game of chess between the managers with different strategies.

I tend to think that if they didn't constantly analysis the game ... we might fall asleep during lulls in the game, lol.

Ya but the women look so damn good on the field and play with heart.

[baller16]

Originally Posted by richief

Lots but unless I watching the game I seem to forget them. This game is such a statisticians dream.

That it is. Here's an example of a list of stats:

http://www.baseball-reference.com/pl...owarry01.shtml

Ignore the "Advanced" statistics because they're a load of horseshit.

[richief]

Just watched the Nationals give the Blue jays a caning, 6 - 2. They just swept them and the RedSox in back to back 3 match series. I can see them taking the NL east easily, they seem to play as though the game is fun.

Now the serious question. I can understand what a fast ball is and I think the curve ball moves to the side to confuse the hitter but what are these all about.

Slider
change up
Knuckle ball

sorry to be asking all these questions but the game really does interest me.

[justpassingthru]

Originally Posted by richief

Just watched the Nationals give the Blue jays a caning, 6 - 2. They just swept them and the RedSox in back to back 3 match series. I can see them taking the NL east easily, they seem to play as though the game is fun.

Puts the Jays at 31-32 so far but of any NL teams that I pay attention to, The Nationals 38-23 (formerly the Montreal Expos) are the only team that I like so that sort of takes the sting off of the sweep but not as far as the standings go.

Lets see what they can do to the fucking Yankees starting tomorrow since they took over the AL east and are 1.0 games ahead of Baltimore.

[richief]

Originally Posted by justpassingthru

Puts the Jays at 31-32 so far but of any NL teams that I pay attention to, The Nationals 38-23 (formerly the Montreal Expos) are the only team that I like so that sort of takes the sting off of the sweep but not as far as the standings go.

Lets see what they can do to the fucking Yankees starting tomorrow since they took over the AL east and are 1.0 games ahead of Baltimore.

That old Yankee Juggernaut is picking up steam again, I think they will wind the series 2-1, I dislike the Yankees style of buying in the best but I do want more success for Deggsy Jeter, he is a classy player and a classy guy (or he hides his sins well), 3000 with a homer just shows the man has style.

So now I like how the Nationals play in the NL, they seem to be the only team that isn't too boring, I like the way the Rangers play in the AL (and I am not going to get on Chrissie's bad side, damn Texas spitfire) and I want more success for Jeter without the Yankees actually winning much, though I do see them winning the AL East with the Os in second place picking up one of the wild cards, fuck the Red Sox I dislike them more than the Yankees. the other divisions I have no idea who will win apart from Texas picking up the AL west.

There is far to much happening in the way this is set up should just have one league for both the AL and NL then let them play a series of round robin matches and the top two from each league go into a series of head to heads to determine who gets the trophy with the flags on it, but I know you will disagree.

I did hear that the inter league series will be arranged better for next season with 20 games played, 16 against the same opponents from the same div and 4 games against natural rivals like the Yanksand the Mets, and so on, seems to be fairer than the way it is this season when one team plays the yanks and another avoids them and gets easier opposition.

[justpassingthru]

Originally Posted by richief

There is far to much happening in the way this is set up should just have one league for both the AL and NL then let them play a series of round robin matches and the top two from each league go into a series of head to heads to determine who gets the trophy with the flags on it, but I know you will disagree.

Since it's too fucking humid and hot to sleep I will respond to that. Actually what you say has a lot of merit and I agree with you that they should attempt to show a more "true" picture of the overall play of all teams by making them play each other and not just come playoff time. Some teams skate by with getting to play weaker teams in their own league to pad their standings. The logistics would be difficult such as travel, makeup games etc but it could be done ... they just don't want to because the MLB has always been "them against us" (AL vs NL) and until every team plays every other teams a few series a season, there will never be a true picture of who is actually the "best" team.

I know that this is a complicated topic and I didn't even touch the surface but more interleague play is a good start right ???

Btw, I am just streaming an exhibition CFL football game with Toronto and Hamilton right now. 29-17 TO in the 4th quarter. YAY, football time again.

[richief]

Two leagues of 15 they play a round robin of home and away matches in a series of 4 games, so each team in the league would play each other 8 times giving a league base of 120 games, then make up the last 40 with inter league play, 30 games round robin in two game series then ten games in series of 5 against local rivals, yanks/mets, angels/dodgers, the teams that don't have local rivals will have to be worked on, all inter league games to be played either side of the All Star break.

[justpassingthru]

History was made last night as Matt Cain throws only the 22nd perfect game in MLB history.

Giants pitcher throws a perfect game
June 14, 2012 -- Updated 0535 GMT

San Francisco Giants pitcher Matt Cain struck out 14 batters during his perfect game, the first in Giants history.

(CNN) -- San Francisco Giants pitcher Matt Cain threw a perfect game Wednesday night in a 10-0 victory against the Houston Astros, the first pitcher to achieve that feat in Giants history.
"This is unbelievable," Cain told reporters after the game. "This is part of history. Something I am going to remember forever and ever."
Cain's perfect game is the 22nd in Major League Baseball history and he accomplished it with style, striking out 14 batters.
Cain is the second pitcher this year to pitch a perfect game. Chicago White Sox right-hander Philip Humber also threw a perfect game on April 21.

[gruzik]

Baseball reminds me russian play "Lapta"

[RandyKnight]

TONIGHT....

Oswalt to make Rangers debut on Friday


The Rangers signed Oswalt to a Minor League contract on May 29. He made four starts in the Minors, with the last one coming on Sunday for Triple-A Round Rock against Oklahoma City. He threw 100 pitches over six innings, allowing two runs on six hits. He walked one and struck out five.

"He's ready to go," manager Ron Washington said before the Rangers' game on Wednesday against the Padres. "The reports we got say he's ready to go. That's what we brought him for, to bring him to the big leagues, and he's ready, so we made the decision to do it. We challenge him now."

[richief]

sadly I only get the games they show on ESPN America, they put out a mixture of the games from around the MLB for expats in Europe (I think) .

But they have been showing the CWS and that is fun to watch.

Hopefully the Rangers will go another game ahead of the "Wherethefuckarewefromthisweek Angels.

[RandyKnight]

Originally Posted by richief

sadly I only get the games they show on ESPN America, they put out a mixture of the games from around the MLB for expats in Europe (I think) .

But they have been showing the CWS and that is fun to watch.

Hopefully the Rangers will go another game ahead of the "Wherethefuckarewefromthisweek Angels.

Rangers play the white sox july 3-4-5

[justpassingthru]

Toronto beat the Marlins 7-1 today to go to 37-34.

HR: TOR: Encarnacion (21) , Rasmus (13) .

Meanwhile ... Colorado is wiping the field with the Rangers 11-1 in the 5th inning.

[RandyKnight]

Roy Oswalt's first outing was a successful win throwing 81 strikes in 110 pitches.....he records his win as a Ranger....

Rangers now have most wins of all teams at this point in the season with 44...

LA Dodgers 43
Yankees 42

[Lookn4awillin1]

My Pirates are still alive...waiting for the wheels to fall off or the owner to trade away any playoff hope.

[richief]

Bottom of the 9th. 1 - 3 down, last out, last strike and Young brings in two. fucking excellent, but not good for my heart. Now we go to extra innings.

[Heyesey]

So, here we are at the all-star break, and the Yankees have (just barely) the best record in all of baseball. How did that happen? And why do Philly suck so much?

[umpire2]

Originally Posted by Lookn4awillin1

My Pirates are still alive...waiting for the wheels to fall off or the owner to trade away any playoff hope.

Bite your tongue!

[umpire2]

Originally Posted by Heyesey

So, here we are at the all-star break, and the Yankees have (just barely) the best record in all of baseball. How did that happen? And why do Philly suck so much?

Well, the Phillies have a lot of talent, but they suck. So, they suck.

As far as the Yankees go, it IS surprising that they are where they are right now, since they have had had more bad luck (as far as injuries go) than any other team in baseball, somehow they have had GOOD luck as far as everything else goes.

The game is strange. If the Yankees were injury-free, and on paper a contender, they would probably be in fourth place in the American East about 1 game over .500.

Go figure.

[RandyKnight]

Originally Posted by Heyesey

So, here we are at the all-star break, and the Yankees have (just barely) the best record in all of baseball. How did that happen? And why do Philly suck so much?

LOL...remeber when I said wait till all star break and it all get started...

to answer your question one reason is the Rangers lost I think 6 straight in the last 8 games..

[richief]

Why do the Phillies suck, 'cos they got baller as a fan, or maybe you can buy individual talent and still not be able to mould them into a team of winners, or maybe it is the baller thing and they are buying players who do not deserve to be on that field, they haven't lived in the ghetto so have no right to play baseball, they are all middle class, suburbanite, douchebags.

[Heyesey]

The Yankees have signed Ichiro Suzuki from the Mariners.

Did not see that coming. Was a poor outfield the reason that we got spanked last weekend by the A's?

[richief]

The A's are on a roll at the moment, either that or the Rangers are in a slump.

[RandyKnight]

Originally Posted by richief

The A's are on a roll at the moment, either that or the Rangers are in a slump.

A's are on a roll but the Rangers are still 4 games up in their division last I looked...

[Heyesey]

Rangers had won 6 of their last 10, before yesterday - which isn't bad at all, but looks pretty bad when the Angels have gone 9-1 and are closing fast.

[RandyKnight]

Originally Posted by Heyesey

Rangers had won 6 of their last 10, before yesterday - which isn't bad at all, but looks pretty bad when the Angels have gone 9-1 and are closing fast.

The Rangers have gone into a pitching problem with 4 pitchers hitting the disabled list. Some are going back now and others will be back. Trade season is not over yet either.

I don't think any tean goes above 600% w/L so it is when you win them that counts a lot...

It is shaping up to be a good ending or fun to follow....maybe some good play offs...what 60 more games?

[RandyKnight]

NY Yankees....67 wins and 47 losses

Texas Rangers...67 wins and 46 losses

and the two teams start a 4 game series tonight

about 45 games left in the season.....

check your team out here.

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/standings/index.jsp?tcid=mm_mlb_standings

[Heyesey]

I've been a little distracted lately by a minor sporting event taking place in London ... I see the Yankees still have a comfortable division lead, but not as big as it was.

[RandyKnight]

Originally Posted by Heyesey

I've been a little distracted lately by a minor sporting event taking place in London ... I see the Yankees still have a comfortable division lead, but not as big as it was.

And tonight I guess I will be flipping channels to watch the Rangers and also the Cowboys play their first preseason game tonight...

[RandyKnight]

Yankess begin to Stumble on stretch run....


It's hard to see Yankees surviving slide to make MLB playoffs as
Baltimore Orioles tie them in AL East

Weak schedule in late September may be Bombers' best hope
because right now they are not playing well enough to hold off young Birds.

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/yankees/a-collapse-hard-yankees-surviving-slide-mlb-playoffs-fall-first-place-tie-baltimore-orioles-article-1.1152197#ixzz25b1aWVKP

Check the standings here....

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/standings/index.jsp?tcid=mm_mlb_standings

[richief]

I noticed that too, they are struggling in all departments, maybe they relied far too much on hitting homers instead of playing a good defence and a good attack.

[RandyKnight]

Originally Posted by richief

I noticed that too, they are struggling in all departments, maybe they relied far too much on hitting homers instead of playing a good defence and a good attack.

Baseball has way too long a season in the modern day....
Too Many Games and teams go up and down as to spirit and have streaks bad and good over the season...

This is not the time of the year to be sliding...

It makes the final race to the pendant interesting...

Rangers seem to be on the upswing but are still hic-uping with the pitching.

In the National League...Washington Looks good..

[Heyesey]

Congratulations to the Baltimore Orioles, who have now secured their first winning season since 1997.

Good news for the O's fans, except that after fourteen consecutive losing seasons I'm not sure if there still are any...

[RandyKnight]

Originally Posted by Heyesey

Congratulations to the Baltimore Orioles, who have now secured their first winning season since 1997.

Good news for the O's fans, except that after fourteen consecutive losing seasons I'm not sure if there still are any...

Yankees are a game up on them....division still open...

[baller16]

Nice to see the Orioles doing well probably for the first time since Ripken. Baltimore has been through a lot so they deserve a winning team other than the Ravens.

It makes me laugh my ass off how it only took 3 years of winning for the Phillies to become hated. They've sucked almost consistently since Larry Bowa left. This right here.. is the Phillies. It's what they'll always be under Charlie Manuel. How he hasn't been fired yet is beyond me.

Oh well......... there's always next year

[umpire2]

Originally Posted by richief

I noticed that too, they are struggling in all departments, maybe they relied far too much on hitting homers instead of playing a good defence and a good attack.

The only problem with this is that statistically, the Yankees have the fewest errors and the best defense in baseball. They not only hit more home runs, but they score more runs, have a higher team batting average and a better team earned run average than the Orioles.

That just shows you that statistics don't tell the whole story.

[baller16]

Girardi's a solid manager though. I don't know enough about their team. Do they have glaring holes this year?

[Heyesey]

Injuries were expected to leave them in a lot of trouble; they've done, perhaps, a little better than most pundits expected.

Not as many injuries as the Red Sox have been plagued with, though; they've lost more players and more total player days to injury than any team for the last 25 years. Not only that, their minor league affiliate is in the AAA Championship so they can't pinch players to fill gaps. They really do have a legitimate excuse for being stone last and stinking up the joint.

[richief]

Originally Posted by baller16

Girardi's a solid manager though. I don't know enough about their team. Do they have glaring holes this year?

They keep losing players to injuries, I have a problem remembering their names, but they lost there closer for the season and there #1 opener CC, and up and down the order they keep losing batters too, also a lot are playing with niggling injuries.

I like Joe and his style of play, but I follow the Rangers and Wash is a great manager also, with quite a solid team, though they lose games they should win. I think we are in for an interesting October

Originally Posted by Heyesey

Injuries were expected to leave them in a lot of trouble; they've done, perhaps, a little better than most pundits expected.

Not as many injuries as the Red Sox have been plagued with, though; they've lost more players and more total player days to injury than any team for the last 25 years. Not only that, their minor league affiliate is in the AAA Championship so they can't pinch players to fill gaps. They really do have a legitimate excuse for being stone last and stinking up the joint.

I noticed that and I would feel sorry for them, but they are like Man Utd, fans all over the world say they are supporters and in the "Bosox nation". I just see a lot of scark carriers, or pennants in this case. Yes I know I seem to support the Rangers but I only follow them, I could in no way find my way to their stadium than these scarf carriers could find Fenway Park, or Old Trafford.

Still like I said an interesting October.

[RandyKnight]

Originally Posted by richief

Yes I know I seem to support the Rangers but I only follow them, I could in no way find my way to their stadium than these scarf carriers could find Fenway Park, or Old Trafford.

Still like I said an interesting October.

directions no problem

London Airport

get on Airplane

direct fligkt to DFW International Airport



take the main tollroad that goes south from the airport 183
till you see Cowboy Stadium


then Look to your left for the ballpark...




side by side.....

[richief]

Originally Posted by RandyKnight

directions no problem

London Airport

get on Airplane

direct fligkt to DFW International Airport



take the main tollroad that goes south from the airport 183
till you see Cowboy Stadium


then Look to your left for the ballpark...




side by side.....

Sweet, now I know how to get there.

Now is it true that the Cowboys stadium cost in excess of a billion ($ or £), that is quite expensive for a stadium.

[RandyKnight]

Originally Posted by richief

Sweet, now I know how to get there.

Now is it true that the Cowboys stadium cost in excess of a billion ($ or £), that is quite expensive for a stadium.

1.2 billion including all the art...

[Heyesey]

Originally Posted by richief

Now is it true that the Cowboys stadium cost in excess of a billion ($ or £), that is quite expensive for a stadium.

$1,150,000,000. Approximately £800,000,000 at the time, and I don't think the rate has changed much since.

When you remember that the cost of land is by far the biggest expense in building anything over here but is usually negligible in the States, and the Olympic Stadium was built for £537,000,000, you do have to wonder where some of that money went. Particularly, I should think, since a lot of it was taxpayers' money.

[richief]

Originally Posted by RandyKnight

1.2 billion including all the art...

Originally Posted by Heyesey

$1,150,000,000. Approximately £800,000,000 at the time, and I don't think the rate has changed much since.

When you remember that the cost of land is by far the biggest expense in building anything over here but is usually negligible in the States, and the Olympic Stadium was built for £537,000,000, you do have to wonder where some of that money went. Particularly, I should think, since a lot of it was taxpayers' money.

Very interesting, thanks. I wonder how many tickets they will have to sell before they start realising a profit.

[RandyKnight]

Originally Posted by richief

Very interesting, thanks. I wonder how many tickets they will have to sell before they start realising a profit.

Jerry Jones is selling it out for all kinds of venues besides the Cowboys..

college games

fights

concerts

motorcycles

circus

it is in positive cash flow right now....

[umpire2]

I sure am glad this is a baseball thread.

Any more about the fucking Cowboys?

[Heyesey]

Originally Posted by umpire2

I sure am glad this is a baseball thread.

Any more about the fucking Cowboys?

Welcome to the internet. (I take it you're new here since you haven't yet learnt the concept of threads going off at a tangent....)