This is how the gays should be treated

[Jamie90]

I feel sorry for the gays in the US right now...at least another countrie´s outrage leads to some positive changes somewhere else

http://news.yahoo.com/merkels-cdu-br...ss.html?_esi=1

Merkel's CDU breaks taboo with call for gay couple tax equality


BERLIN (Reuters) - Members of German Chancellor Angela Merkel's Christian Democrats (CDU) have called on parliament to grant gay couples the same tax benefits as married heterosexuals, a shift for the conservative party that has fuelled anger among their Bavarian coalition partners.
Family Minister Kristina Schroeder has backed a call from a group of 13 CDU lawmakers who are appealing for a change in the law to put gay couples on an equal footing in terms of tax breaks, saying now was the right time for a change.
"In lesbian and gay life partnerships, people take long-term responsibility for each another and live according to conservative values," said Schroeder.
Same sex partnerships have been legal in Germany since 2001, but gay couples do not enjoy the same tax benefits as heterosexuals.
The move, which comes about three months after Barack Obama became the first U.S. president to back same-sex marriage, drew swift support from Merkel's Free Democrat (FDP) coalition partners and the opposition Social Democrats (SPD).
However, the CDU's Bavarian sister party, the predominantly Catholic Christian Social Union (CSU), railed against the idea.
The CSU accounts for about 20 percent of Merkel's conservative bloc in parliament and could stop any legislation. The party has given Merkel a headache with its opposition to euro zone bailouts and its rhetoric is getting even tougher in the run-up to a difficult state election next year.
Its members lined up to say such a move would undermine the sanctity of marriage.
"Marriage between a man and a woman must be especially protected because it is fundamentally oriented towards the propagation of life," said Gerda Hasselfeldt, the head of the CSU's parliamentary group in Berlin.
Another obstacle may come from CDU Finance Minister Wolfgang Schaeuble, a conservative from the southern Catholic state of Baden-Wuerttemberg.
An extension of the tax breaks to Germany's 23,000 registered gay couples would cost 30 million euros ($37 million)a year, said a finance ministry spokeswoman, a fraction of the 20 billion euros in tax breaks for heterosexual married couples.
However, she added that the issue should be put on hold until after a long-awaited ruling by the Constitutional Court on income tax differences.
The court's rulings in a series of cases in the last few years, including one on Wednesday, indicate it will say gay couples should be treated equally to heterosexuals in terms of income tax. A broader decision on the issue is expected next year which may force the government to act.
It was largely due to pressure from the court that the CSU agreed to a pledge to abolish tax disadvantages for same-sex couples in the three-way coalition agreement with the CDU and FDP, a party which champions individual rights.
But that a group of lawmakers in the CDU, which has Catholic roots, feels it can push the issue underscores Merkel's willingness to break some traditional tenets of her party.
In her seven years in office, Merkel has shifted her conservative party's policy platform significantly to the left - from abruptly accelerating a nuclear phase-out to backing a minimum wage and abolishing army conscription.
Such moves, on top of broad agreement with the SPD on the euro zone debt crisis, have led analysts to speculate that she will pair up with the biggest opposition party for a "grand coalition" again after next year's election.
Polls suggest that outcome, which would be a repeat of the coalition she led between 2005 and 2009, is a strong possibility, due largely to a slide in support for the FDP.
The SPD raised the pressure on Merkel on the gay couple question on Wednesday, saying it would draw up a cross-party motion on the issue to see if the conservatives would agree.
($1 = 0.8052 euros)
(Additional reporting by Matthias Sobolewski; Reporting by Madeline Chambers; Editing by Noah Barkin and Myra MacDonald)

[Druidoak]

Everyone sould be treated the same, no matter sexual preference!

[SilverLycan]

Good for Germany.


I think it's shameful that gays still aren't granted equal rights under the law in America. This isn't the middle ages.

[ejls]

I'm not sure why you feel sorry for all of the gays in the US. Married gays (in the states that allow marriage) have the same rights as married hetero couples. Single people (gay or hetero) have a different tax structure than marrieds. Newly single, I am paying a higher tax rate. Why not just feel sorry for single people who are living with someone but not married. They don't have rights either.

[darthel0101]

"Marriage between a man and a woman must be especially protected because it is fundamentally oriented towards the propagation of life,"

I call bullshit.

Marriage is and always has been a SOCIAL structure not a RELIGIOUS structure. The problem that the shaman have is that they are no longer involved in as much SOCIAL interaction and regulation as they once were. Simply look at where marriage is regulated and then do as Christ said, "Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's …" and eliminate the inequality of treatments.

[SilverLycan]

Originally Posted by ejls

I'm not sure why you feel sorry for all of the gays in the US. Married gays (in the states that allow marriage) have the same rights as married hetero couples. Single people (gay or hetero) have a different tax structure than marrieds. Newly single, I am paying a higher tax rate. Why not just feel sorry for single people who are living with someone but not married. They don't have rights either.

The problem is that no one goes around beating the shit out of single or cohabiting people, tying them up behind a pick up truck and dragging their corpse in the street. There are places in the US where gays are still despised, hated, reviled, simply for existing.

[shyguyy2]

Originally Posted by SilverLycan

The problem is that no one goes around beating the shit out of single or cohabiting people, tying them up behind a pick up truck and dragging their corpse in the street. There are places in the US where gays are still despised, hated, reviled, simply for existing.

Places like Laramie,Wy where I went to school they took that one gay guy and left him for dead tied to a fence post in the middle of nowhere and he died.

[ejls]

Originally Posted by SilverLycan

The problem is that no one goes around beating the shit out of single or cohabiting people, tying them up behind a pick up truck and dragging their corpse in the street. There are places in the US where gays are still despised, hated, reviled, simply for existing.

I understand that. I believe that's true in more places than just the US. My objection is to the blanket statement of feeling sorry for gays in the US. The statement is too broad and doesn't take into consideration the areas that have advanced to the point of recognizing their unions. Any time you stereotype an entire nation, you should be prepared for arguments against it.

[Druidoak]

Marriage as we know it today is religious, even if your married by a judge you still swear to a religious ie. Christian set of moral values, or Muslim, or Jewish or what ever. As long as people ie. Government and our judges can not seperate their religious brain washing from their job we will have a problem.

[SilverLycan]

Originally Posted by darthel0101

I call bullshit.

Marriage is and always has been a SOCIAL structure not a RELIGIOUS structure. The problem that the shaman have is that they are no longer involved in as much SOCIAL interaction and regulation as they once were. Simply look at where marriage is regulated and then do as Christ said, "Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's …" and eliminate the inequality of treatments.

Marriage is definitely a social construct, but it's dressed up as a religious ceremony because people like making things official. Jesus said that marriage is a concession given to humans by God, but He didn't intend for us to live like that originally. After giving humans marriage, we turned around and asked him to take it back. And so He gave us divorce.

Originally Posted by shyguyy2

Places like Laramie,Wy where I went to school they took that one gay guy and left him for dead tied to a fence post in the middle of nowhere and he died.

Yeah I remember when that happened, and there've been a few other attacks like that.

Originally Posted by ejls

I understand that. I believe that's true in more places than just the US. My objection is to the blanket statement of feeling sorry for gays in the US. The statement is too broad and doesn't take into consideration the areas that have advanced to the point of recognizing their unions. Any time you stereotype an entire nation, you should be prepared for arguments against it.

I apologize for the blanket statement. I'm bitter and cynical, and it's easy to stereotype.

Originally Posted by Druidoak

Marriage as we know it today is religious, even if your married by a judge you still swear to a religious ie. Christian set of moral values, or Muslim, or Jewish or what ever. As long as people ie. Government and our judges can not seperate their religious brain washing from their job we will have a problem.

Another issue is that people essentially get married twice. There's the religious ceremony, then the business contract that's part of being married under the law.

[anotheruser1]

Why do we allow government to choose our morals. If you want to be gay that's your business not the governments. They should only step in it becomes a problem in public.

[SilverLycan]

Originally Posted by anotheruser1

Why do we allow government to choose our morals. If you want to be gay that's your business not the governments. They should only step in it becomes a problem in public.

It's the loudmouth christfags that are making this a public problem. They're always looking for a reason to announce a morals crisis in this fucking country. If it's not the drugs, it's the secret satanic molestation sex cults that have invaded the schools and day cares, or the rainbow party orgies, or the drug parties, or teenagers and their darn rock music, or black people being all differenty and scary from suburban middle class white Americans, or baby murdering abortionists, or sand people building a community center (OMG IT'S A MONUMENT TO THEIR VICTORY ON 9-11!!!), or some other fucking thing so they can get in the goddamn spotlight.

[anotheruser1]

Originally Posted by SilverLycan

It's the loudmouth christfags that are making this a public problem. They're always looking for a reason to announce a morals crisis in this fucking country. If it's not the drugs, it's the secret satanic molestation sex cults that have invaded the schools and day cares, or the rainbow party orgies, or the drug parties, or teenagers and their darn rock music, or black people being all differenty and scary from suburban middle class white Americans, or baby murdering abortionists, or sand people building a community center (OMG IT'S A MONUMENT TO THEIR VICTORY ON 9-11!!!), or some other fucking thing so they can get in the goddamn spotlight.

Never gave it much thought, I always try to keep to myself and stay out of others business. When they do that type shit it does piss me off. There is always a fight for the spotlight over trivial bullshit.

[Druidoak]

Originally Posted by anotheruser1

Why do we allow government to choose our morals. If you want to be gay that's your business not the governments. They should only step in it becomes a problem in public.

Becase everyone in government is a member of a monotheist religion, they cannot seperate their job from their religion.

[the fox]

Hi how are you doing today

anyway all I will say is gays should be treated the same as anyone else.

hell we are just people after all

[Heyesey]

Originally Posted by Druidoak

Marriage as we know it today is religious, even if your married by a judge you still swear to a religious ie. Christian set of moral values, or Muslim, or Jewish or what ever. As long as people ie. Government and our judges can not seperate their religious brain washing from their job we will have a problem.

You can get married in the USA without saying a single word; no need to swear to anybody about anything.

[the fox]

Originally Posted by Druidoak

Marriage as we know it today is religious, even if your married by a judge you still swear to a religious ie. Christian set of moral values, or Muslim, or Jewish or what ever. As long as people ie. Government and our judges can not seperate their religious brain washing from their job we will have a problem.

actually no you can be married without any religious vows also having seen a us marrage by a judge there is no metion of any religion

[Grunehilde]

Originally Posted by Druidoak

Marriage as we know it today is religious, even if your married by a judge you still swear to a religious ie. Christian set of moral values, or Muslim, or Jewish or what ever. As long as people ie. Government and our judges can not seperate their religious brain washing from their job we will have a problem.

I don't agree that marriage is purely a religious institution. Today, "straight" people can be married by a justice of the peace, or registrar in Britain. In fact, over here couples have to register their intent to marry and for it to be sanctioned by the State, even before they get married in any church.

[shyguyy2]

Originally Posted by Grunehilde

over here couples have to register their intent to marry and for it to be sanctioned by the State, even before they get married in any church.

Same in the states they have to purchuse a license first for it to be legal.

[ejls]

[QUOTE=SilverLycan;5283499]I apologize for the blanket statement. I'm bitter and cynical, and it's easy to stereotype.[/QUOTE

No apology necessary. You didn't create the opening post.

People of every race, creed and color are discriminated against in every country on this earth. You tell me where they aren't. People are brutalized for their beliefs. We only have to look back in history for the worst of it and then look to our contemporaries to see that some people still follow along in their discrimination. The US is not the only country that has flaws but it seems that people are always quick to point it out.

[Jamie90]

Originally Posted by ejls

I'm not sure why you feel sorry for all of the gays in the US. Married gays (in the states that allow marriage) have the same rights as married hetero couples. Single people (gay or hetero) have a different tax structure than marrieds. Newly single, I am paying a higher tax rate. Why not just feel sorry for single people who are living with someone but not married. They don't have rights either.

No, I meant that because I heard, due to recent events with that chicken-fil-a place some laws making it easier for gays have been called back?

Of course I am not involving all those positive things ejls

I think it would be extremely hard to be gay in some more rural areas of the states and I feel sorry for them that they may have to pretend to stay alive!

[shyguyy2]

Originally Posted by Jamie90

I think it would be extremely hard to be gay in some more rural areas of the states and I feel sorry for them that they may have to pretend to stay alive!

I live in a very rual area and know for a fact it would be hard. In my area parents are likely to kick their own kids out of the house and family for being gay because it's "against god". The shallow mindedness of my area makes me mad at times. They would give me shit for being a Atheist if it wasen't for the fact I'm the the highest decorated vet still alive in the area my grandfather being the highest.

[ejls]

I live in a rural area surrounded by farmers fields. I also live in a progressive state which allows for gay marriages. Gays hold significant offices in our local governments. It all depends where you're from. It would be like saying some countries still discriminate against Jews, given their history. It would be wrong for anyone to make a blanket statement about any country.

You may not agree with what any individual says here, but they have the right to say it.

You'd think by now I'd be used to the trashing my country receives here, but I'm not. I still don't know why people don't take a closer look at their own houses.

[Jamie90]

Originally Posted by ejls

I live in a rural area surrounded by farmers fields. I also live in a progressive state which allows for gay marriages. Gays hold significant offices in our local governments. It all depends where you're from. It would be like saying some countries still discriminate against Jews, given their history. It would be wrong for anyone to make a blanket statement about any country.

You may not agree with what any individual says here, but they have the right to say it.

You'd think by now I'd be used to the trashing my country receives here, but I'm not. I still don't know why people don't take a closer look at their own houses.

you can never generalise, and I didn´t mean to offend you...but it would make for very long sentences if you had to make sure you didn´t include everybody in every statement one makes!

[ridgerunner]

do you judge based on the color of the eyes or hair?
i grew up between the res and rural kentucky
now im in texas the most idiot filled state in the country
and we have 2 openly homosexual people on the city council 1 of which i reccomended based on his education and level of knowledge

any idiot that hates "gays" is fighting the fact that we all are to some degree samesex oriented

[rood_dood]

Originally Posted by ridgerunner

any idiot that hates "gays" is fighting the fact that we all are to some degree samesex oriented

dont know about that
i never got turned on by a dude

but every body deserves the same respect
except the idiots

[darthel0101]

Originally Posted by rood_dood

dont know about that
i never got turned on by a dude

but every body deserves the same respect
except the idiots

Sex is not strictly homo -vs.- hetero but a grey-scale with all shades in between.

The ones that I feel sorry for are the ones at the extreme ends of that scale because they have little to no capacity for appreciating the other side.

The ones that I FEAR are the ones towards the middle who do not allow themselves to see that they are in the middle. THOSE are the militants of either end.

[Druidoak]

My statements were concerning the general perception in the United States of marriage.

There are exceptions to most rules. I myself am licenced to preform non traditional marriages in the state of Ohio. I was also married by a judge in 1977 in Akron, Ohio, and it, the ceremony had religious over tones though it was held in a court room.

[michael saint]

I can't understand why anyone would want to be married anyway.

I suppose if you like to dress up and say things in front of other people it makes some sense, can't think of anything else though.

[smcaaphd]

[AZRIEL]

[smcaaphd]

[steve_vme]

Originally Posted by Druidoak

Everyone sould be treated the same, no matter sexual preference!

Gays do not treat others the same. No groups do.

[shyguyy2]

Originally Posted by steve_vme

Gays do not treat others the same. No groups do.

Thats bullshit. Of course they do they just want to be treated equally and they are in a fight for it right now.

[AZRIEL]

donneren blitzen.jpg

[smcaaphd]

[Tightcuntlover]

All I can say is....There are some seriously fucked up in the head people on this thread.....

that doesn't include me of course.

And....isn't Merkel a lesbian?

That might make her somewhat bias.

[Jamie90]

No she is not

Love the vid smc

[AZRIEL]

[steve_vme]

Originally Posted by shyguyy2

Thats bullshit. Of course they do they just want to be treated equally and they are in a fight for it right now.

No one treats each other as equally human. If the did there would be no human suffering or homosexuality.

[Ed Itor]

The homosexual community is not very welcoming, I tried to join the lesbians and they refused me. I tried the courts and they told me if I pressed my case I'd have to get a psych test. I just wanted to be accepted for my sexual preference, Women.

"Nobody loves me, everybody hates me, I'm going to the garden to eat worms ..."

[M4MPetCock]

Homophobia: The fear that gay men will treat you the way you treat women.

[xoxoxo3922]

Originally Posted by Ed Itor

The homosexual community is not very welcoming, I tried to join the lesbians and they refused me. I tried the courts and they told me if I pressed my case I'd have to get a psych test. I just wanted to be accepted for my sexual preference, Women.

"Nobody loves me, everybody hates me, I'm going to the garden to eat worms ..."