We all tend to agree that honesty and openness are the best way to combat sexual dilemmas and personal difficulties. Though I have pondered how someone might approach the more sensitive ones without seeming insensitive, suspicious or accusatory?

1. Like when a husband, wife or lover is still revered as an interest of deep passionate love, but for whatever reason you've grown disinterested in them sexually?
2. Realizing after living heterosexually, admitting you're bisexually curious even if you have no intention on acting upon it?
3. The most serious lastly as to the likes of potential pedophiles, rapists, incestuous minded who do they confide in that they have this trait without assuming they've acted on it?

Although #1 is the only one that has been a personal struggle for me I've always wondered if #2 and #3 would be easier if our standards of sexual education and an emphasis on proper sexual maturity were more instilled as a gold standard at a younger age. Open to serious discussion as judgments would only prove my point.

 

You are running before you can walk! The repression of sexual freedoms such as those perpetrated by islam should be more of a concern or that admitting bisexuality carries personal risk in some parts of the world like Eastern Europe and Africa (where you can be jailed for drinking Bailey's Irish Cream because the judge thinks it is a gay drink)!!!

The issues that you describe appear inconsequential compared to the above!

Thinskin

 

Ok, I have to say this...
I know eastern Europe seems like a fucking backwards region to most people in the western world, but, dude... Eastern Europe is not Africa. And while you MIGHT get the shit beat out of ya for being openly gay or bisexual at a wrong place / time, I assume I could find places in any country of the world where that's the case. But it's not an actual threat to your freedom, career or wellbeing in a general sence. Sexual freedom is protected by law, and while gay people can't get married, we're working on it... Eastern Europe made strides in the right direction over the last decade.
Please.
We're not savages.

 

I concede that Eastern Europe is not as backward as Africa but there are many countries particularly those suffering Russian influence where discussing your sexuality with your partner might just take second place considering the attitude in one's closed minded society (the subject of this thread!!).

An article from 2013.....

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/jul/30/gay-rights-world-best-worst-countries

.......and an article from 2015.......

https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...13078d03dd3_story.html?utm_term=.bde5e632a0f5

Thinskin

 

Who is this "WE" you are speaking of?
Honesty and openness needs to be mixed with a little common sense.

 

This is why when I'm a parent I'm going to try and be as honest as possible with my kids. I grew up in a house where sex was NEVER spoken of, which I'm convinced screwed up my ideas about sex and delayed my sexual maturity significantly. It took a lot of years to figure shit out.

As an aside, I do have incestuous fantasies. I finally told my wife in the last year, and it was such a relief that she was okay with it. Because of how repressed society is about some things I had assumed that anyone I told would immediately think I was a monster of some kind :/ I'm sure that fucked my mind up too!

 

This is not an issue of a "closed-minded society" and more of a problem between the two partners involved.

If you have no intention on acting upon it, why make it an issue at all? Not every fantasy needs to be shared.

I wouldn't throw pedos, rapists and incest freaks all in the same basket. Obviously, as apparent on this board, people who have incest fantasies have no problem talking about them on the internet, while pedos would possibly be met with a lot less understanding. Rape fantasies fall somewhere in between, I feel, though I'd bet they're at least as popular (if not more) among women especially. I have no trouble talking about rape fantasies with my partner, and while I'm not really into incest, I understand that a lot of people are. It's a fantasy, not MY fantasy, but oh well. Pedo, I don't know. Just feels wrong, though I understand that pedophiles need counsel as well. I guess that's what psychotherapists are for.

 

Definitely do that, I can attest to how even the most well intentioned and respect I have for virginity can affect the future of your child. My wife is 53 now and due to her lack of sexual understanding still has age old issues with what most here would consider rudimentary.

That's awesome you were able to be so open and successful, but I speak more of the trait rather then fantasies.

 

I wouldn't say that as when you're at that breaking point and susceptible to desires beyond the boundaries of your relationship such as cheating. Society is quick to bastardize the cheater and doesn't recognize the responsibility of the other of whom (in many cases) is just as much at fault. As I've said before "If a man even thinks about cheating he's told to either told to man up or leave despite what actions he's taken to rectify it, a woman thinking of cheating is almost always accepted as the man's fault anyway"

It's society that perpetuates and permeates the collective thought that it's many times a man's overburdening nature for sex and a woman's oppression under that rule of thumb that is the single cause of cheating?

In my opinion: Full disclosure in a matured relationship is essential to the rule no secrets which can by virtue enhance or complicate matters.

Aside from fantasies all the examples are a potential abuse of power and manipulation, I don't think there's many who would feel comfortable admitting openly to another thoughts like these beyond fantasy. If however we were a more sexually educated and open to a sexually mature society it could (in theory) help us avoid the monsters lurking inside the mind of some at a younger age?

P.S.Thank you for such a detailed reply

 

These are not matters concerning better sexual education.
1 Is a matter, and the reasons for it, to be openly and honestly discussed between the two people involved. It does not involve any others, unless the disinterest and resultant frustration is causing more open animosity between the two affecting other family members. If the problems are beyond them discussing them, there are professional marriage councillors.
2 and 3 There is an engineering phrase "If it isn't broken don't mend it" - why draw attention to something it is not intended to act on. Doing this can almost be considered selfish, you are putting your problem onto others. If the thoughts are bothering so much that you feel that help is needed then seek professional help, where they can be openly discussed without judgement.

As to the matter of other countries' and religion's attitudes towards certain sexual acts - just accept that those are their norms, they may be wrong according to 'ours' but they are not according to theirs - to try to inflict our norms onto them is of itself being judgemental.

Paedophilia is again a matter of 'judgement' dependant upon the norm of a counties laws/religions - the age of 'free consent' can vary between anything from 12 to 18 years of age. When working abroad I have quite legally, and on their part freely, been offered a 12 year old, in many countries in Europe 14 years old is legal, in the UK 16 years old is legal.
Even the rules of this site are 'judgemental' in not taking this into consideration, considering the many different countries the members come from. Does such a (supposedly) open site as this require better sexual education?
Personally I consider anything under the age of puberty to be wrong.

As for the norm against incest this is based, no matter how it is now formulated, on the age-old old knowledge that any children resulting from incestuous acts carry a very high risk of abnormalities, and this includes acts between second cousins. This risk is so high that here in the UK there is now a very strong educational program aimed at people from the Indian sub-continent to try to get them to change their tradition of marriage between cousins, due to the high rate of abnormalities in the children of such marriages.
There is a humour West Indian Calypso on this matter "Shame and Scandal in the Family" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shame_&_Scandal

To further 'confuse' the matters of Paedophilia and Incest - in certain 'uncivilised' societies it is the accepted norm that at puberty the young are initiated and taught about sexual matters, even to the taking of virginity, by an older close family member.

To give ' Better Sex Education' on all the various norms would not be just a matter of a few better classes but would involve a full course on anthropology.

 

I wish society would get rid of many of the sexual rules that we are all forced to live by. We only need a couple of rules to have a happy healthy sexuality.

As long as a person is consenting, can give consent, and that consent is given freely, I think anything of a sexual nature should be allowed, and legally protected.

I frequent BDSM and Swinger clubs, and the rules they have to abide by, in licencing, and what you can and cannot allow, is ridiculously restricting.

Also prostitution, strip clubs, and porn, all have so many rules and regulations that they become less than completely enjoyable for all involved.

So, when people say we are in a society that is sexually liberated I'd like to know where they are are looking, because in my experience we are still a very prudish society. Yes, some places have legally accepted homosexuality as being normal, but even those countries are still filled with bigots who won't even accept marriage between two people of the same sex. And if more than two people want to indulge in sexual activity together, everyone involved is still considered a bad person.

My final note, on this post, is the age of consent laws. They are out dated and need to be readdressed. For me there should not be any legal age of consent laws, only consent laws. So if a person wants to have sex, star in porn, or become a prostitute, age should not be a factor. I know, children should be protected from predators, and the consent I mentioned would cover that. Where children are concerned their parents and guardians should be able to allow consent if the children become sexually active. A clause would also be put in place that you cannot give consent for a person to have sex with you if you are their guardian.

 

Fair enough. However, you didn't talk about cheating in your OP. But okay, if you want to talk cheating, then I'd say it would first and foremost also be an issue to the two (or three, or however many) people involved. To put this all on society seems a little too convenient to me. After all, you don't have to argue with society over its feelings or look it in the eyes in the morning. It feels like what you want is a blank cheque that days it's okay to cheat.

Well, in my opinion, you put too much credence into "no secrets". Sometimes, secrets are what enables us to live with one another.

Fair enough, but again, not what you were talking about in the OP, which specifically only mentioned "potential" perpetrators. However, I believe your faith in sexual education is entirely misplaced in these cases. Rapists and pedos don't act out of sexual repression.

 

Maybe suicide bombers do though!!

thinskin

 

What do suicide bombers have to do with anything here?

 

I acknowledge all writings and I will reply after work, thanks for the participation

 

There have been cultures which accepted pederasty and rape as acceptable sexual outlets for men. I can't imagine that children or women thought they were living in an open minded society.

As for #1, a lot is invested in the phrase "for whatever reason." There seems to be a contradiction in terms, with "deep passionate love" and "disinterested in them sexually." How does that work? How does one have passionate love, without sexual interest? The "whatever reason" is critical. Has this person lost all interest in sex(for whatever reason, age, health, etc), or has sexual interest been transferred to someone outside the relationship. I can imagine the more sensitive ones would find it easier to understand a general loss of all sexual interest, than a sudden renewal of sexual interest because a new partner is available.

 

Yes UNCIVILIZED cultures even in modern day third world hell holes or in the past of American history. No body comes out of the package cultured as it's learned, taught and ingrained, as for what we do with it is individual?

@Bron Zeage if you had met, fell in love with and cherished only one truly virgin woman by waiting, you'd know that in the absence your most precious gift that a deep passionate love can exist only selflessly through suffrage for the relationship as a whole. We didn't make love for over a year, but that's not to say that the feelings weren't there for either of us, only that they were expressed into more passionate kissing and slow escalation of intimate touch. As you can think of our progression, the baseball metaphor of rounding bases should come to mind!

 

It's all a lack of education the way we approach sex given our knowledge of how it actually works, both of my kids were raised with age appropriate sexual talks. My daughter had my love a granddaughter at a young age which was a choice that full circled to our adopting her as my newest daughter this year. My son's in love with what I hope is my future daughter in law and respects the blessing and the curse that sexual exploration can bring if it's not mindful, beautiful and dirty within chosen limits. Our children need to know it all and like mine be able to and encouraged to act and responsible enough to assume the risks of Love and Lust!

 

Do we honestly know "how it actually works"? I think not.
After over 30 years of a (very) active sexual life if I sit and calmly try to work out what sex is about, apart from reproduction, it has me completely baffled in all it constantly changing variables - what was physically and emotionally OK yesterday wasn't today but might be tomorrow.
I agree that the 'mechanics' of sex can be taught, with even more stress being put on the importance of the (usual) emotional content but whilst mechanics can be taught emotions cannot, because they are an indefinable constantly changing state of mind, influenced by everything and everybody in life and not just the sex.
To attempt to try to educate in the 'totality of sex' is an impossibility - there are too many different aspects involved, many not even fully understood by the many so called professionals, from the medical to the psychological and then throw in the various religious edicts.
Then top it all off with the 100s of sites such as this on the internet, where after 1,000, 000s of years of sexual activities of all kinds there are people still seeking help and advice, because every day somebody, somewhere, is coming up with a new question/problem/sexual activity, even apparently a new 'sexual gender/orientation'.
If you got together every profession involved in sex, along with representative of every religion and let them all talk about sex for as long as they wanted there would still be as much confusion at the end as there was at the beginning.

 

@Jonme You are wrong.

We know exactly what sex is when we don't complicate it with calling it taboo. Sex is three things:

1. Sex is the physical act of procreation
2. Sex is an act of intimacy that helps two or more people become closer in order to raise their offspring
3. Sex is a way of enjoying physical pleasure for a number of reasons: Stress relief, domination, procreation, submission, escapism, and many more

It's only when you add various taboos that sex becomes complicated. If all things were permissible, and I am including all sexual practices: Missionary, doggy style, straight, bisexuality, homosexuality, transsexual, desire for blonds, rape, necrophilia, pedophilia, bestiality, incest, basically everything, only then do we find sex is really simple: The enjoyment of pleasure.