This is the second time you have asked me if I wanted to debate you and for the second time the answer is yes. But unlike the last time you will not get out of it by backing off and sending me a bunch of phony kiss ass PM's.

Now I have stated the outline of my position so its your turn to respond so put up or shut up Deidre.

 

All together now, 1,2, 3, 4,...


Lyrics to We Can Work It Out :
(by The Beatles)

Try to see it my way,
Do I have to keep on talking till I can't go on?
While you see it your way,
Run the risk of knowing that our love may soon be gone.
We can work it out,
We can work it out.

Think of what you're saying.
You can get it wrong and still you think that it's alright.
Think of what I'm saying,
We can work it out and get it straight, or say good night.
We can work it out,
We can work it out.

Life is very short, and there's no time
For fussing and fighting, my friend.
I have always thought that it's a crime,
So I will ask you once again.

Try to see it my way,
Only time will tell if I am right or I am wrong.
While you see it your way
There's a chance that we may fall apart before too long.
We can work it out,
We can work it out.

Life is very short, and there's no time
For fussing and fighting, my friend.
I have always thought that it's a crime,
So I will ask you once again.

Try to see it my way,
Only time will tell if I am right or I am wrong.
While you see it your way
There's a chance that we may fall apart before too long.
We can work it out,
We can work it out
[ We Can Work It Out Lyrics on http://www.lyricsmania.com/ ]

 

Not trying to start more shit hen necessary, but:

The "government" ran Social Security, and pretty much everyone who has a job pays social security, and it doles out pretty much a set amount to each recipient after retirement or a certain age or whatever, and that failed/is failing.

The "government" pretty much regulates the education budget, determining what things are worth learning and the like and currently (as of the last anything I read about our education system) is slowly working it's way down the ladder toward ineptitude, continually and routinely cutting music and art programs, non-mainstream sports programs, advanced education programs and CDC programs.

NOT to mention our ever increasing deficit which collectively puts each "american" in the hole around $10 large.

So seriously, let's not move to socialize healthcare into government control until they can prove to us that they can continually and effectively implement and improve the very basic things like the Budget, our SS, and our education.

By routing the SS, they've fucked many elderly, by decreasing educational options and programs they fuck our future capacity to solve these problems and by continually fucking the budget they insure that by the time someone smart enough to solve these problems comes along there will be no stock in the barrel to get the show on the road so to speak.

So seriously, let's try not to hand over anymore of our anything to these people. Please.

I would propose the following:
1: Money cannot be the deciding factor in how this country is run. And by that I mean, He who spends the most money makes the most money. IE: Major Chemical donates $100 large to half the senators in office as a campaign contribution to pass legislation restricting and or illegalizing(not a word I don't think but desperate times call for desperate measures) the natural supplement industry. Natural supplements can now not be made with natural ingredients and must be made as synthetic natural supplements thus tipping the financial scales in favor of major chemical, who already have the processes for synthetic natural supplements.

If a candidate is in office, he/she is already paid a salary by us, the people, to invest in our best interests. When our bests interests are circumvented by Big Business best interests we lose freedoms of choice and opportunity.

The very practice described above could also lead to the further injustice of "Insider Trading" If x amount of senators are on the payroll of a major company and know that their votes will tip the scales in favor of that company, then they also know that company and or Big Business Block will most likely receive some financial windfall as their competition is eliminated. Thus a savy investor need only vote where the money tells him to and invest where he voted to ensure HIS or HER personal financial well being at the cost of the TAX PAYERS FREEDOMS OF CHOICE and OPPORTUNITY.

In some fashion, somehow, there must be some form of prevention of this activity.

I might suggest the following:
1: The election budget is the same for all candidates, and they must earn their attention based on their merits and ingenuity. I don't know about you, but I can make $20 go a long fucking way when I have to and I suggest those in charge should start practicing the same thriftiness as a majority of their population has too.

2: They should be allowed equal air time set by each major radio and or tv media station/producer as a courtesy. If compensation is required then perhaps a separate budget for media should be induced, but in all seriousness... The news makes it's money off of politics, it would seem only fair to allow some free air time to take care of Business every 4 years. After all, we ALL live in this country and sans the implementation of this proposals there WILL BE NO CHANGE IN POLICY, and we will continue as a people to lose to big business money and large INTERNATIONAL corporate Lobbying.

3: They are paid by the taxpayers a fair wage well above the national average. This should be enough.

Once we have a congress, and senate, and white house full of people who cannot be bought, bullied or bribed, then perhaps we'll have a government full of people capable of making educated independent decisions about what could be best for us the people. The individuals who make up this country.

And those in charge found to be accepting these motivations and incentives should be made to announce them publicly. Where they are coming from, for how much, and wether or not you accepted them, so we as a people can understand exactly how you've been selling us out and so one day, maybe, we can forgive you.

 

Stumbler, please you are the jerkoff who needs to shutup with your socialistic view of the world. Go start a political forum with your little friends, good riddance, do not speak to me. You sir are scum. I will let the brick debate you, way 2 smart for me.

 

Now you have the gall and ignorance to challenge me to a debate confidently stating that I will lose and this is the best you can come up with.

See I knew you neither had the intelligence nor the courage Deidre to try and back up your challenge, which publicly proves what a mouthy little fool you really are. Its right there in pink and white.

So instead of me starting my own political forum why don't you keep your ignorant overbearing skinny ass off these threads because you do not have the intellectual capacity to discuss any of the issues.

That should be embarrassingly clear to someone even as thick headed as you.

PS And also stop commenting on other topics you know nothing about such as maturity.

 

Dang you guys. I thought I had some good ideas there, but apparently you're to busy fighting each other for dominance to pay attention to anyone else.

 

Thank You !
You do have some good idea's and valid points while I do not agree in total, thank you for bearing pass the bs from the troll.

I think it's time to add her to the ignore list, pity though the program here still allows for her posts to show in quotes

 

Its too late for me to address all your points but I would like to hit a couple of the first points and then I'll try to get back to this.

But just briefly I would say the claim that Social Security and our public education system are failing are misconceptions not facts. Can you provide any documentation that Social Security is failing? Can you show how our public education system is failing? If you can't then the primary points of your objections defeat your argument.

 

Stumbler, you win! I would not waste my time on here with you when i can be talking with my real friends. Peace...You can start your own forum. Why don't you? What don't you understand about this pic, I think it speaks nicely to what I want to say and what I feel towards you. I defend you and you come back like that? fu sir!

 

Irrelevant!
All countries pay sales and other taxes(VAT, and "sin taxes"--smokers pay the most total taxes of anyone!)

I thnk "fees for service" can be a real problem too.
Waiting fimes for surgery vary, from juridiction, to province or territory.
In Ontario, things have got worse in terms for elective surgery, and there is `emergency or er' surgery.
Which types of surgery?I will read more but overall I would say that our system is not what it used to be and the brain drain: nurses and doctors going elsewhere has been going on for decades.
Revamping and examination is a must!

I think some of the money raised from taxes on alcohol and tobacco should be diverted to our running, and your proposed systems.

This is an assumption!
Inappropriate pictures of women? Hah! This is a poor joke? Just because you disapprove? Are you some `male *pukes* feminist?
I have seen a lot of stupid jokes(speaking loosely) on this forum
As well as `overage tennagers',good/fun, and bad/insulting/annoying.
How would one back up a claim of stupidity, with regarding a comment about another poster. Well, I can here with you, and it is a fact, as it were...this is silly this part, and you are `off track'.
Hardly one to be an expert on trolls, sir.
Where did you copy this from(given I have got good info from places like wiki)?

I apologize for my spelling failures, few as they are.
I should get the gadget installed? I don't really make such a big deal on other people's spelling or grammar, not "bee trolling", as when one points this out.
This nitpicking is often seen as a last resort when the respondent is limited in what he can counter his target with.
I get a giggle here too.

Back to the OP

 

Dude you wanta cyber that cunt fine, does she need your freakin protection or what, Beside who give a fuck what you think, I don't.
I'll say whatever I like and if I need your opinion on that, I'll scratch my ass.


Your nothing more then a avatar that types, now (thanks Inky)

 

Dpm, you seriously make me sick also with your view of the world and your view that we should all live like that. Get a haircut you dork. Are you black? I know Stumbler is, let's get it all out on the table! Cmon Stumbler, you told me you were white. I don't believe you. Are you Rock Princess? I wish piggit would tell us. Hey the trashtruck is coming, if you hurry, you can ALL hitch a ride to the landfill. Dkr

 

What do you want to debate Stumbler?, bring your little girlfriend Kimiko.

 

Whether one thought your ideas were good or not, the important thing is you have ideas. Apathy by individual citizens, inept or corrupt leadership in government and industry, and no one stepping up with IDEAS to bring viable solutions to our problems are the ruin of our great nation. Send your resume to the new President , maybe a cabinet position for you THLC.

 

Dude, I can't pass a background check to work at T-Mobile, so... whatever...


BUT, Back to the topic at hand... or.. more or less to give stumbler something to read tommorrow:

Education:

Declining SAT scores:

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2007/08/29/sat
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_kmusa/is_/ai_n16918283

Google: School dropout rates vs. global On your own...

School program funding cuts:
http://foundationcenter.org/pnd/news/story.jhtml?id=73800033

HIgh School comparison 1998
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/artic...archive/1998/02/25/MN54903.DTL&type=printable

Not all of these are current, but... I sincerely doubt any dramatic changes have happened overnight as in my search I found nothing that said anything about "Great strides being made in American public education" In fact quite the opposite.

Primarily, with the gradual waning of the middle class, more lower income families exist then high income families. Lower income "High achievers" (roughly 38% within their group) were less likely to continue their education to a college level, and of those who went to college even less to grad school. Whereas roughly 58% of high income families where "high achievers" in school and a majority of these kids would go onto college and half onto grad school.

Whatever the hell that means.

I would guess at a between the lines reading of: those who excel in school from lower income families do not for whatever reasons have the ability to attend universities of higher education.

For really, there's only so many grants and loans are still only offered to those who are deemed to be able to pay them back.

This also breaks down pretty intensely by geography and demographics and the such.

So... Honestly after looking over this for a minute I couldn't find any conclusive evidence either except for the SAT scores... and I don't think a standardized test is the best means to discern educational ability.

As far as SS is concerned, I did stumble upon this:
http://www.aarp.org/money/social_security/frequently_asked_questions_about_social_security.html

Which... since it's coming from AARP and those folks are usually johnny on the spot about retirement, that's good news.

So, First 2/3rds of that rant can be nixed. Which is a little relieving, but being the rampant cynic I am, I'm going to have to say the jury is still out on the above but it's looking favorable for the home team. Fair?

As far as the deficit, the means for funding the elections, and the like, I think I'm pretty spot on.

Google "the Grace report" on your own.

You may discredit my introduction, but the conclusion feels truer to life then I would like. As it is a known fact that election campaigns are funded by contributors and the greater the contribution the greater the expectation of favoring your contributors as their money ensures your career.

And there is an ass ton of money to be made in major pharmaceutical, Technology (in particular surveillance), and Chemical (IE: How DOW chemical tree pulp to paper franchise spin doctors engineered the anti-hemp legislation...)

And I worry excessively about the Technological advances as it makes it easier and easier to infringe on a persons "personal space" and privacy, either from government watch dogs or adept curious hackers. I strongly feel that policy should always lean towards educating, compassion, and redemption instead of invading, condemning, retribution.

and holy shit this has nothing to do with health care. LOL... I'll work on that one later.

 

​

 

Too funny...as usual.

 

Don't believe all you hear from Canadian whiners and American haters... the Canadian system is good. The doctors speak English, the wait times are reasonable, and the care is excellent. I have no complaints about the medical care I have received and it's good to know it's there when I need it. I would never support the American model.

 

Pericles, keep your canadian system, I am so glad you are proud of yours, I am too, mine that is....... socialized medicine? sorry again. Dkr

 

I wasn't offering it to you and the sarcasm isn't appreciated.

BTW... Canadian is spelled with a capital C.