Detroit: Black Mob terrorizes and beats whites.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6z3grPRstdY

DETROIT, MICHIGAN: THE DOCUMENTARY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0JsqTdfXWc

Riots + looting

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CxmMdOvEGY0
Riots of The 1960's

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJeNk7MI_ow


im not trying to be "racist" just pointing out there trends in the past.. as well as right now! look at these videos quick because they wont be up long...they always get pulled guess the powers that be dont want the Mass's to see



I have suffered for the love of my country
i never agreed with the campaigns i was
involved in Bosnia, Kosovo, Afghanistan,
Iraq. these places are forever etched in my mind
the worst part of being a soldier is you cant
choose the wars your country fights you wear
the burden for life.

 

Exactly. What the UAW objected to was the attempt to bust the union by GOP lawmakers who were intent on revenge for voting democratic in the past election as well as having vested interests in foreign auto manufactures who have located in some of their home states.

 

Ford's most advanced assembly plant operates in rural Brazil YouTube - Ford's most advanced assembly plant operates in rural Brazil

Did UAW prevent Ford from building this plant here?



I have suffered for the love of my country
i never agreed with the campaigns i was
involved in Bosnia, Kosovo, Afghanistan,
Iraq. these places are forever etched in my mind
the worst part of being a soldier is you cant
choose the wars your country fights you wear
the burden for life

 

You both have your socialism hats showing.

Please point out to me and rest of us ignorant slobs, how the concessions asked of the UAW is "Union busting". Then tell us how concessions started in 2011 will help the industry today.

Then tell us how the situation in the US auto industry is different to the one with the steel industry in the 1970's and 1980's. We have no steel industry left, all of the steel workers are out of jobs, pensions and union support, what if they had made the concessions that Carter had asked for? The USWA gave up .03/hour in a MAJOR concession.

 

Actually your consistent pattern of trying to attach negative labels to anyone who disagrees with you is what is showing.

What the UAW objected was the strong arm tactics used during the Senate conferences which demanded concessions right then without studying the problem and meeting with their members. They also objected to the obvious political motivations.

The loss of the steel industry was actually the result of outsourcing the industry to other countries.

 

Internal memos leaked to the media make it clear that the GOP agenda was to punish the UAW. It's a matter of record now, despite your denials.

 

This to me is the most digusting form of partisian politics and shows the GOP are more interested in spiteful reactions then actually trying to help the nation survive the worst finanicial crisis since the great depression. Little wonder they lost the last election so badly and hopefully will lose the next one even worse.

And you're proud of having to resort to negative labels when you can't defend your argument? Figures.

You obviously don't have anything more than a Deidre like response to this point either.

Who's being childish tenguy. The unions who want to study concessions and discuss them with their members or the GOP senators who wanted to punish the union members for voting democratic even if it sends our economy into a depression?

Now you show me where the autor industry CEO's and owners have agreed to salary and bonus concessions because I haven't seen those demanded buy the GOP senators or you for that matter and I haven't seen any concessions made by management.

Yeppers that's how I already classified your entire argument on this point and you haven't done anything that would indicate let alone prove otherwise.

 

Hey Stumbles, how about you get something besides sawdust in your cranium.

You still haven't come to grips that someone said no to the unions and the US auto industry. Twist it anyway you'd like, it still says that the unions refused to do what the CEOs agreed to do. That is totally selfish, no other explanation. As Bob asked, "tell me what month in 2009 you will begin the cutbacks?" the UAW reps walked, this is how they negotiate.

The UAW is holding the american public hostage, they are banking our auto industrys future on Bush blinking.

 

ROFLCOPTERS:excited::excited::excited::excited: tenguy.

A handful of obstructionist GOP senators tried to pull off a underhanded power play which won't work because their GOP president is going to go ahead and bail out the auto industry despite their petty objections and obstructionism.

Show me where the auto industry management has agreed to concessions and then allow the UAW the same time frame to come up with the concessions they are willing to make. And remember some of those concessions would require going back on promises made to retirees which is a pretty shitty thing to do to people who already made their contributions.

Its not the UAW trying to hold the American people hostage. Its the same old shitty GOP obstructionism over petty patisan politics because they lost in the last election.

 

Not only do you TRY to rewrite history, you TRY to rewrite current events.

Every single source said that the US Big Three had agreed to cuts in executive salaries, suspension of bobuses and dividends to stockholders as a condition to receiving the loans. You try to say they didn't, nice try Stumbles, you fail again.

Every single source said the UAW refused to grant concessions until 2011, you fail once more, give it up you lose again.

What is pathetic is you actually believe your own bullshit.

 

I asked you to show me the sources tenguy.

And while you're at it since you are making the claim show me the sources that say UAW refused to grant concessi8ons until 2011.

Try not to get so hysterical about this stuff. If every single source (indicating there must be more then one) said these things it shouldn't be too difficult to provide one.

 

Yay Bush!

First time I've been proud of him since...2000.

Great decision.

 

Okay, your move.
https://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7778830.stm

http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,1865232,00.html?iid=tsmodule

 

We could start another thread altogether about unions and corporate heads and the ongoing battle of these two powers in industry. While I greatly support unionism as a mean of bargaining power for the working force I have in my lifetime seen where unions have abuse the power they hold over those businesses that employ their members, and to a greater extent I likewise have seen corporations bust unions and remove that empowerment from many unions.

Now as to the American car makers, I would question this:

In the long run will America car makers survive ? The bailout is going to be short term to say the least, America is not buying their cars now nor is the world. This problem we face is going to be years in it's resolve.

American corporate heads are spoiled as are the American unions, it's time to wake up and see that there is no easy way out of this.

 

IMO, you are correct on your assessment of the big three auto makers, personally I doubt that there will be three by the end of next year. One politician said something like: "We need to help them get to an orderly bankruptcy" whatever that means. If we front them the $15 billion, many predict we will follow it with another $185 billion by the end of next year, GM is in debt to the tune of $92 billion, with no credit line left. It seems like $15 billion wouldn't hold them for a month or two.

Whatever moneys we put up, will be lost if they don't severely reduce their operational costs, a huge part of that is labor related. With the union saying no deal, the game is lost before it starts. If the union agrees to immediate cuts to competitive labor rate levels with the foreign auto makers in the US, they have a little better shot at it.

One thing is fairly certain, the US will recover sooner than later, the recovery will come after the system gets weeded. The American and global consumer will buy automobiles, in the US the industry is well represented by profitable producers, other than the big three.

Nissan, Toyota, Honda, Volkswagen, Hyundai, BMW, Mercedes, etc. all have a large presence here with modern high production, labor efficient plants. Detroit has mostly outmoded, inefficient monstrosities, that they and the UAW want us to subsidise.

 

Oh, ok, my move. Then "check."

I never said any such thing as the US Big Three did not agree to cuts. What I said was:

The Big Three not only showed up begging for money after flying in on corporate jets, one or more initially said they didn't think they should have to make salary concessions for their CEO's. It was only after congress rebuffed them the first time that they DROVE back to Washington DC the second time with hats in hand and said they were willing to make the other concessions.

And "checkmate"

Because you said:

But these are a lot more then single sources and they say the UAW is willing to make concessions.

1. As Hearings Resume, UAW Offers Concessions - washingtonpost.com
   
   Dec 4, 2008 ... Yesterday, UAW President Ron Gettelfinger said that his union was ready to make new concessions despite a landmark cost-cutting labor ...
   www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/12/04/AR2008120400799.html - Similar pages
2. UAW to renegotiate labor terms, suspend jobs bank - Yahoo! News
   
   The United Auto Workers said Wednesday it is willing to change its ... U.A.W. at Center of Dispute Over Bailout New York Times – Fri Dec 12, 7:23 am EDT ...
   news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081203/ap_on_bi_ge/autos_uaw - 81k - Cached - Similar pages
3. With The Auto Bailout On The Rocks, UAW Decides To Make More ...
   
   With The Auto Bailout On The Rocks, UAW Decides To Make More Concessions ... Yeah, I’m too sure any of you selfish brainstems would be willing to take pay ...
   sayanythingblog.com/entry/with_the_auto_bailout_on_the_rocks_uaw_decides_to_make_more_concessions/ - 217k - Cached - Similar pages
4. Silobreaker: UAW will make concessions to save automakers: union boss
   
   Dec 3, 2008 ... UAW will make concessions to save automakers: union boss. ... Gettelfinger said Wednesday that the union is willing to change its contract ...
   www.silobreaker.com/DocumentClusterReader.aspx?Item=16_932088077 - 169k - Cached - Similar pages
5. Buck Naked Politics: UAW to Make Concessions: What About Obscenely ...
   
   Dec 4, 2008 ... Yahoo News tells us that the United Autoworkers Union is willing to make big concessions, ... Senate Considers Auto Industry Bailout ...
   bucknakedpolitics.typepad.com/buck_naked.../uaw-willing-to-make-concessions-what-about-obscenely-paid-executives... - 37k - Cached - Similar pages
6. GOP: Don't blame us, blame the UAW - Manu Raju - Politico.com
   
   Dec 12, 2008 ... In an interview with Politico, Corker said that the bailout plan lost any hope ... That said, the UAW is willing to make concessions but why ...
   www.politico.com/news/stories/1208/16545.html - 180k - Cached - Similar pages
7. U.A.W. to Change Contracts in Bid to Help Detroit - NYTimes.com
   
   Dec 4, 2008 ... U.A.W. Makes Concessions to Help Automakers ... Workers union said Wednesday that it would make major concessions in its contracts with the ...
   www.nytimes.com/2008/12/04/business/04auto.html?hp - Similar pages
8. North Texas UAW workers say they're willing to make concessions ...
   
   Dec 3, 2008 ... North Texas UAW workers say they're willing to make concessions. ... a close look at the bailout proposals the companies sent to Congress. ...
   www.star-telegram.com/business/story/1073091.html - 63k - Cached - Similar pages
9. Defeat of bailout frustrates UAW members -- GazetteXtra
   
   Over the years, the UAW also has made concessions on wages to help pay the ..... their jobs either when they are not willing to make some sacrifices for it. ...
   gazettextra.com/news/2008/dec/12/defeat-bailout-frustrates-uaw-members/ - 328k - Cached - Similar pages
10. toledoblade.com -- Auto workers to hold emergency meeting on bailout
    
    Dec 2, 2008 ... Not only that, it shows that the UAW is willing to work with the Big 3 ... upper echelon in the Big 3 are also willing to make concessions. ...
    www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20081202/BUSINESS02/812020273 - 57k - Cached - Similar pages

This quote looks pretty ironic now, doesn't it tenguy?

 

Ancient history Stumbler, the Senate asked the UAW to meet the Japanese automakers US pay scale and they refused. Pretty straight forward refusal to me as well.


You said post an example and I did. You post stuff from before the hearings, on topics that were not included in the request of the Senate. I asked you one simple question and you didn't answer it.

How can the US big three be competitive when the labor costs are significantly higher than their competition?? Not only is the hourly wage higher, but the union benefits are more costly. Several times the UAW tried to organize the Nissan factory in Smyrna, TN, the largest automobile assembly plant in the US. They failed, why? Because the benefits of belonging to the union did not measure up to the benefits of not belonging.

The UAW is out of touch and so are you.

 

Try watching this video of the new Ford plant in Brazil, even though the comment on the blog is from a staunch anti-union perspective it does ring true.

 

Just can't do it can you tenguy. Its impossible for you to admit it when you're wrong no mater how obvious it is and right there in blue and white for everyone to read.

So lets try purple again.

Every single source said the UAW refused to grant concessions until 2011, you fail once more, give it up you lose again.

There can you see your statement this time or should I go to #7 type face.

But OMG will you try to switch horses in mid stream, change the subject, create diversions, contradict yourself. Anything, anything at all except say OK I was wrong on those points.

PS Let me guess. It was one of the Senators from your home state in Tennessee with the foreign auto plant their trying to protect that walked out on the bail out.