OK let's try this. Can anyone of you provide even one documented case of a meth lab expolsion? Next, there are several pamphlets and web sites that list the ingredients for making meth. Look at them and you should be able to realize that almost all of them are common houehold items all of you have in your houses and use constantly. It should be noted that the vast majority of meth is now being manufactured in Mexico and smuggled into the United States. Also if meth was as deadly and dangerous as your government would have you believe they would not force US Air Force pilots and other military personnel to use it to perform their jobs.

Secondly, for all the pictures and posters of meth users, I'll bet I could go downtown right now and take pictures of the hunderds of homeless alcoholics that would look far worse than the extreme cases the government is using for propaganda.

And finally all the problems with marijuana growing are the direct result from it being illegal. It is the most begine of all drugs, one of the most beneficial for a number of conditions and illnesses, and is the answer to both our dependence on foreign oil and a big step forward in reducing green house gases and global warming.

 

...and it can get you really high man....

 

She left us out Stumbler lol Sex addicts whoa yes goooooooooooood

 

You forgot forum addicts.

 

...and anti-depressant addicts!

 

i didn't say anything about lab explosions...i was merely saying they are having a lot of problems in this area with meth labs. there have been several busts in my area. the chemicals, i have read/seen, i honestly don't know for fact, are much more poisionous once they have been "combined" or whatever it is they do to them to make meth...and yes, they are common things, however i know that anhydrous ammonia is/can be used because it was getting stolen from the farmers and had been found during some of the busts.

there was just recently a news report on one of the local radio stations about how when new inmates arrive, the older (not age, but duration of stay) drug user inmates ask them what drugs, if any, they are/were on. if they say meth, the older ones pick of thier scabs and eat them becasue they contain "un-processed" (for lack of a better term) meth. they also reported that in the jails and other places, meth users are drinking thier own and other meth users' urine becasue of the un-processed meth in it. they said they are taking such drastic measures becasue of the recent crack-down on availability of drugs used to make it such as sudafed.

i'm curious where you heard/how you know that military personnel are required to use drugs to do their job... i have never heard that ever and have several family members/friends who are in such positions...i'm just asking, not trying to be bitchy..

 

Boy those are some pretty good stories Countrymama but I'd sure like to see your sources since methamphetimine is entirly out of your system in three to ten days max and people are off drugs a lot longer than that before they end up in prison.

As you also point out such a hazardous material as anhydrous ammonia is sold to farmers in huge quanties and used as fertilizers for our food. But you don't need to steal it from farmers you can go down to your local grocery store by ammonia, throw it in the freezer and get anhydrous ammonia. While your at the store look around and you'll see the sudafed is still there and so are the ephedrine tablets.

Now, I'll have to do a little research to give you a current source for the government's use of methamphetimine but it's been on the news a couple times. The most notable of which was just before the Iraq war when an Air Force pilot filed a grivance and requested a hearing because "he did not want to be forced to take meth on his bombing mission." The Air Force's official postion was that if the Pilot did not want to have to take meth he could file for another mission. But it was (and is) Air Force policy that bombing missions of that many flight miles and hours requires a dose of methamphetimine at a certian point in the mission.

Also when Barry McAffrey became the Drug Zar and came to Wyoming to campaign against meth, since he had just came out of the Air Force he was asked about the military's use of the drug. He first declined to answer the question, but when asked point blank if he could categorically deny the Air Force required pilots to use the drug he said No.

 

Here's a source on how long drugs are in your system after usuage.
http://jobsearchtech.about.com/od/laborlaws/l/aa090301_5.htm

 

And here's a source confirming the use of Methamphetamine by the Air Force.
http://stopthedrugwar.org/chronicle-old/249/uspilots.shtml

 

interesting

 

you know. people say hugs not drugs.

 

RE: Documented case of a meth lab exploding...I just googled "meth lab explosions" and this is the very first article I found among several...haven't read all of it and I don't know how to delete the advertisement.


Meth lab explosions put hospital burn units in a bind

By LEON ALLIGOOD
Staff Writer



In an operating room at Vanderbilt University Medical Center, burn specialist Dr. Jeffrey Guy peered at the outstretched arm of his patient. The limb is a raw, bloody span of flesh picked clean of damaged skin in preparation for grafts.
The patient, who lives outside the Nashville area, was severely injured earlier this year when a methamphetamine lab exploded.
Meth injuries are not unique at Vanderbilt's Regional Burn Center. A week ago, seven of the critical-care unit's 20 beds were filled by patients whose injuries were meth-related, either from making the homemade drug or from hurting themselves while under the influence of the highly addictive substance, according to Guy.
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This patient is unique, however. He's a two-timer.
A few months before his latest injury, the man spent weeks recuperating in another hospital's burn unit after a meth lab flared up.
''This time he comes to us for a few months,'' said Guy, referring to Vanderbilt's Regional Burn Center, one of the largest burn injury units in the South.
Total estimated bill from both conflagrations: near $1 million. At Vanderbilt, the bill is already approaching a quarter of a million and is rising at the rate of $10,000 a day.
How much will Vanderbilt be paid for the critical care?
''Zero,'' Guy said, matter-of-factly.
''What drunk drivers are to emergency rooms, methamphetamine is to a burn center. This is uncompensated health care. Vanderbilt is private. We don't receive state funds for this type of care.''
Meth, a stimulant that has become the drug of choice in many parts of rural Tennessee, is typically concocted in homemade laboratories. The object is to transform pseudoephedrine, a key ingredient in many over-the-counter cold remedies, into methamphetamine.
To do so requires several potentially volatile reactions produced when various chemicals, including brake fluid, lye and lantern fuel, are combined over heat.
One misstep can bring a meth maker to Guy's operating room.
And, as patients go, meth users aren't good patients.
The influx of meth patients at Vanderbilt's burn unit has risen so dramatically that Guy fears the care will harm his unit's mission. The man on the operating table is a good example. He had to be brought to Vanderbilt on a medical plane at a cost of thousands just for transportation.
''I've got a clinical mission to care for thermally injured patients within 200,000 square miles,'' Guy said. ''That includes those in meth labs. Vanderbilt is always going to do the right thing. The question is, how long can we continue to provide that kind of service?''
Unfortunately, burns are a ''disease of the economically challenged,'' he said.
Generally, 35% of all burn cases seen by the Vanderbilt hospital are not covered by insurance.
''When we look at meth patients, in excess of 90% of them have no insurance. Who pays for that? Society does,'' Guy said.
According to The Journal of the American Medical Association, trauma patients who are meth users are more likely to have longer stays in the hospital and the bill they run up is likely to be significantly higher.
In the JAMA study, which examined 212 minimally injured trauma patients, the authors concluded meth patients require ''an increased use of hospital resources, measured by length of stays and charges.''
The average length of stay for meth patients compared to the general population increased from 1.7 days to 2.7 days. Hospital charges for the meth patients were $4,000 higher than the general population.
For burn patients in particular, the rule of thumb is they stay in the burn unit one day for every percentage of their body affected by third-degree burns. If a patient's injuries cover 60% of his body, a stay of 60 days is expected.
''We see only the worst cases,'' Guy said.
At the recent annual methamphethamine conference in Nashville, Guy told accounts of some of the worst, including a man burned so badly in a meth-related explosion that his stomach had to be opened due to swelling. His intestines were held in place by a tent of plastic stapled to his midsection.
On a screen behind him flashed a photo of that man in the burn unit.
''This is what happens when you mess with meth, when meth messes with you,'' said Guy, as audience members flinched.
''This is what every person who cooks meth ought to have to see.''
Dan Ramage, a licensed clinical social worker who works in the burn unit, said patients injured in meth lab accidents don't cease to be a burden once they are discharged. In fact, often the opposite is true because of underlying substance abuse problems, marital discord and financial worries the person had before the injury.
''This is a much larger problem for the community. Dr. Guy may save the person's life and I might provide some counseling services while they are in the hospital, but when they leave they face the same problems they used to have. Now, some of them also have terrible disfigurement to adjust to,'' Ramage said.
''It's a terrible situation, especially when you consider that most meth patients are from rural America. These are good ol' boys who have become addicted to this stuff and it's absolutely destroyed their lives, and in rural areas there are even fewer mental health and other services than you would find in a metropolitan area.''
Later this year, the burn unit is expanding to new quarters on the Vanderbilt campus. Nine beds will be added.
Guy said he has no hope that the excess beds will remain empty for long. Many of them will be filled by patients with burns caused by the production of meth, he speculated as he stapled skin grafts to the man in his operating room.
''I wish I could say he would be the last,'' Guy said, ''but he won't.''
By the numbers
$10,000
The typical cost of care per day for a person in the burn unit at Vanderbilt University Medical Center.
75
The percentage of meth labs that Tennessee accounts for in the Southeastern United States.
1,259
The number
of meth lab discoveries in Tennessee in 2004.
6
The number of high-frequency percussive ventilators in use at Vanderbilt's burn unit. The ventilators breathe up to 500 times a minute for burn patients, which promotes healing and keeps the lungs clear.
$10,000
The going price per square foot of lab-created ''skin'' used in skin grafts.
600
The average number of critical burn patients treated each year at Vanderbilt.

 

Ths to me is another example of the overhyped propaganda involving the dangers of meth and meth labs. Like stills they do have their mishaps but I would point out that even in the article the doctor points out that he treats burns for both addicts and meth labs.
I live in a state where they also bust a lot of meth labs and I'm not even aware of a fire. He also doesn't give any percentages of how many burns they treat and what percentage of those are meth related.
Instead he goes into the cost of treating uninsured patients which would be true for more than 40 percent of our population.
What I have seen is cops dressed up in hazardous material suits and touting the cost of cleaning up meth labs where no lab actually existed.

 

Well, this is only one article from one hospital in the country...

 

I realize that, but if meth labs were anywhere near as dangerous as the governments claims there would be hundreds of them and you would be reading about them in your local newspapers.
I have also seen several horror stories involving meth labs and yet do not see the statistics or the incidences to back them up.
There are also several different ways to make meth some more hazardous than others but there would be far fewer mishaps and costs involved if drugs were just legalized and sold in drug stores.
By the clean up costs pale in comparison to what it costs to keep drug users in prison.

 

Articles about meth labs are always in our local newspaper and on the news.

 

They may not be AS bad as the US gov says..but with frequent use:

 

I don't doubt there are a lot of busts. What I'm talking about is what the government claims in the extremely hazardous nature of them. Keep in mind were talking about 1000's of labs (apparently by the statistics you gave) and I sure don't see credible evidence that 100's of them are blowing up.
There is bound to be lots of labs, and some of them run by people who didn't have good sense before they ever touched drugs, because the demand is there. The demand is always going to be there no matter how many labs they bust, or how many people they put in prison or in jail for using them.
The exact the same thing happened during prohibition of alcohol back in the 20'swith the exact same results, poisoned alcohol, still accidents, organized crime all the things that come with prohibition of anything people want.

 

Are you sure Fanfiction? Do you use alcohol, tobacco, perscription drugs, vitimans? They're all drugs. And nothing has proven more destructive than prohibition.

 

i personally dont think drugs or alcohol is inherently bad.. that they are bad evil things on their own..

i think irresponsible people are bad..

i personally believe in moderation in all things.. have your fun.. live your life.. do what you want to do.. but when it comes time to do what youre supposed to be doing.. you'b better be able to deliver.. if drugs and alcohol start to inhibit your ability to function.. or just alters your copacity altogether.. you are a problem and must be dealt with..

otherwise.. live life.. have fun.. do the damn thing.. just make sure youre still a contributing member to society and youre in the green with me..

ive seen both ends of this spectrum.. where drugs and alcohol have destroyed lives.. but ive also seen people smoke weed.. drink every frickin day.. and make it to work on time.. clean cut and ready to make it happen..

drugs and alcohol are not bad things.. its people and how and when and how much they decide to consume these things thats the problem..