I thought this one deserves its own thread because the Israeli/Palestinian conflict has been a topic of so many discussions around here and this is the first opportunity we have to actually see if a peaceful settlement can be reached or as others claim the thousands of years of hatred and religious differences make peace impossible.

Here's where we're at right now.

Direct talks 'to resume' next month

http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2010/08/20108203210436454.html

 

I also wanted to link the thread for the Gaza Flotilla to this thread for handy reference, because I think these things over lap.

https://forum.xnxx.com/showthread.php?t=159124

 

There will be no peace because the people from both sides do not want peace. Most conflicts/wars end by either one side being near completely destroyed or the will of the people to continue fighting is lost. There appears no demands from the general populations from either sides to want peace.

This will be just two sides seeing if the other will change positions and give them what they want. Neither will and at best there will be some non important or life changing things agreed upon to make it look like there was progress.

 

I freely admit every indication and all past history supports precisely what you're saying here.

But I am holding out hope and looking for things that might make a difference because I believe all humans are capable of being rational and logical and killing each other more out of habit than anything else is neither of those.

And besides I've been so wrong, so many times, on things like this and my eternally springing hope one more time won't make any difference.

I'll take another 1,000 yard shot.

PS I remain amazed at the Performance of Secretary of State Hillary Clinton. One thing that I've seen as a pattern with her is she works so quietely there's silence between historic announcements.

 

The problem that has plague the Middle East for a very long time is that most of the people living there do not have a decent quality of life and do not believe it will improve or be better for their children. They simply have nothing in their eyes to lose and therefore less motivated to compromise and demand peace from their governments.

When you have nothing most people turn to their faith because it is the one thing they can control and feel good about. This is why extremist are so easily bred in that region.

 

I'm probably at least as cynical as the two of you are...but not so cynical that I can't see some value in keeping these talks alive. As long as people are talking, they might stop fighting long enough to see that it's futile to continue doing it.

"...and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more."

 

We can only hope they never stop trying to find a peaceful solution, after all, we all have one thing in common, we all have red blood running through our hearts, so lets not spill it because of stupidity.

 

"to resume next month"..........right

free beer tomorrow......

 

buy what are they gonna make out of the tanks, rockets and AK47s.,,???..:excited:

 

Thousands of years from now, people will dig up the rusty remains and speculate that we used them to predict eclipses with.

 

LOL

 

Maybe we could melt them all down and make something that actually
benefits people.

 

Yep I went squirrel hunting up the hills with a AK47 one time....
weren't nothing left to fry after you hit them little critters............

 

And I'm sure the irony that this in many ways is the richest region in the world has not escaped you, nor the sense of humor of a God, if there is one, that would put oil everywhere else except these disputed territories.

But there are resources, especially in an outsourced world, and there are people on both sides forged and tempered by the heat of the conflict who are still not tainted by it.

You also said the word; children. Since John Kennedy I've never been able to believe that parents anywhere else can love their children less. Extremists? Sure. But the average man and woman, no I can't believe that.

Plus what you're really saying in my ears, if you'll allow me to interpret it differently is what a difference a job might make.

Maybe, but to me not so much. When you have nothing, or at least when I did, I turned to my hate and anger, never admitting, in fact denying those had anything to do with fear, let alone were a secondary reaction. Not being afraid was a value I was willing to die for without realizing any of the implications. i.e. The only reason one can not be afraid to die is to actually be more afraid to live.

Whether its the Talban leader, or hate fueled extremist Iman, or Glenn Beck or some skin head they are all just doing the same thing. Using people's fear, hate, sadness, frustration and resentment to fuel them.

Because that's easier, way way easier, than looking inside and making peace with what you find.

The old town sheriff we used to have hated to carry his gun because it hurt his hip. He was more than 60 years old and wasn't that big to begin with. His nearest back up was at least 25 miles away. You know how he not only survived but did his job which he defined as protecting and serving the public?

He knew and practiced simple physics: "You can talk a long time with the amount of breath it takes to fight a man."

Fighting is the easy part. It saves you from admitting you are afraid. Its also the most irrational, uncontrollable, and as dangerous as a human can be.

 

Don't we get this "Historic moment" every ten years or so. Once again the west appears to be looking for a miracle to emerge from the glittering promise of peace in the middle east, I believe nothing significant will be achieved until Hamas are at the same table, anything else will be "A Bright and Shining Lie" a lie we all want to believe.

 

Actually I think its every new US president that tries it. And as far as any glittering promise of peace from what I'm reading this morning most "experts" are claiming this peace initiative has less chance of success than previous attempts.

I'm going to keep my bet that something will come out of this but at this point I'm betting on wishful thinking instead of any real indications of progress towards peace.

But on the other hand if anything does come out of this I can truthfully say the Obama administration defied all odds.

I swear though that I actually think its Secretary of State Hillary Clinton that is gaining ground behind the scenes and may have the ability to talk to both sides openly and honestly.

 

It is time for the US, the EU and Russia to tell both sides if you don't make progress with a peace initiative then they will get no more support, no cash, no bombs, no missiles etc, etc, etc.
Or lets all just walk away and let them sort it out amongst themselves and only when they are left with rocks to throw at each other go back and ask if they want to have a quick look at the "Roadmap to Peace".

 

This is something I've been advocating for more than 25 years. And firmly believe would work to finally force a settlement. I think our blind support of Israel and failure to stand up to Israel is one of the primary reasons some terrorists see the US as their real enemy.

I'm convinced the first president and congress that finds enough courage to stand up to Israel and the Israeli lobby and cut off funding and support is the administration that will successfully achieve a peaceful settlement.

I would be more than willing to cut off all aid and support to both Israel and the Palestinians and pull our troops out of the region. And if they want to kill each other after that, fine. At least we're not the ones paying for it.

 

It wont happen, this goes back several decades,there are to many grudges,and some folks thrive on grudges.

 

Place your bet Ace. I already admitted I'm betting against the odds. But I'm sticking with it.