If obozo would stop going on TV and dividing America and all this other crap maybe we would be doing better.

But here is a man that knew the housing caused this mess and he has yet to do anything other then tell the banks to re-write mortgages, it was the government and directives from then that caused this mess. look up CRA (community reinvestment act) and see how it worked.

He has done everything to stop growth in America. And yet some still love the ass wipe.

He and ALL of congress needs to go.

 

Yep, and anybody who says otherwise has a fundamental misundertanding of business. You don't hire people just because you can.

Not to mention the fact that businesses are sitting on a record amount of liquid assets right now. Theory = blown

And you just described another reason libertarians don't live in the real world, congratulations! They'll have to move out of their parent's basements eventually!

 

Quote: The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. End partial quote.

Or you are using a Microsoft product!!!!!

 

Obama's threat to stop social security payments caused my body to react such in my sleep I clenched my teeth so hard, that it was over a week before I got them back to normal without pain, or being able to chew on that side. I can think of no other cause that would have made that unconscious fear. I am not a fearful person consciously.

No social security-can't pay rent-get evicted- lose everything I have-live in my car or on the street.

I also work but couldn't even support my apartment on that income.

Minimum wage since no one but this company will hire anyone over a certain age because the company health plans don't want to cover them, so tell the companies not to hire people over a certain age.

Companies owned by individuals not corporations may be the exceptions.

 

My own basement, my parents never owned property.
And I am a socialist ty vm. Share the wealth with those less fortunate than you.
Treat others how you would be treated, work for the betterment of the society, not your own self interests.

And yes I realize some of the more ignant can't see the difference between socialist and communist.. but I can't fix stupid or decades of McCarthyism.

 

Thanks for the effort you put into the example but I find it meaningless. Yes, you explained the multiplier effect pretty clearly but, when talking about the businesses, who's to say that Dominic makes $3 mil every year that he's open? MC and MR change throughout a firm's operational history and the profits would change accordingly.

So, you really haven't answered my question. If there is a lack of demand, how can Dominic keep his shirt? I'm not saying taxes CANNOT lower demand, I'm just saying that tax cuts do not always increase demand.

And ease up on the Marxism. Centralized economies pre-date Marx. The US was built on some government involvement in the economy. Ever read Hamilton?

And Marxism is not a dirty word. I'm not a Marxist, but its a credible economic perspective.

 

I agree. Its a depression.

I'm not a Keynesian but I agree with Krugman here:

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/28/opinion/28krugman.html


But we will get out of it with the right attitude. Both sides of the political spectrum need to come together and work towards a solution.

 

I'm not talking about you

 

That's about par for the course. Congress comes in and fuckes the working people , as usual , and the working people pull back on spending the economy begins crashing and congress goes on vacation for a month with no one here to fix their fuck up

 

This is an interesting list of reasons tax cuts do not benefit the economy. I think these reasons are probably true, but I wish they were better documented. I would like charts that document these assertions state by state, country by country:

"The economies of states with higher overall tax levels actually grow faster than the economies of states with lower tax levels. For example, analysis of data from the Department of Commerce, the Bureau of Economic Analysis, and the Federation of Tax Administrators shows that whereas the top 10 fastest growing states in the U.S. had a top corporate tax rate of 7.1%, the bottom 10 slowest growing states all had the same tax rate — 6.2%...

"An analysis of over 100 years of economic history shows that the economies of developed nations (especially in the European Union and North America) with higher tax levels grow faster than the economies of nations with lower tax levels."
http://www.mea.org/tef/pdf/2toptenreasonswhytaxdontgroweconomy.pdf

Since 1980 hatred of taxes has become Republican identity politics. Country club Republicans do not think they need a public sector of the economy. They do not want to pay for it. Christian conservatives do not want to finance a government that they consider to be hostile to their religious faith and values. Facts do not change opinions based on hatred. They do win debates.

 

unfortunately the asshole does not go out of business because the new Latino work force who live 15 to a house take the lower pay because their shared living expenses are less..than the US worker

for that you then build a different scenario

 

Ah, but therein lies the rub. Which ever way you slice it, a higher living standard makes us a target for those who exploit those who will accept lower wages (and living standards).

The only difference between this scenario and the destruction of the US garment workers jobs, is the competing work force simply slipped into our country, virtually unopposed, instead of the work being done offshore.

 

I have to admit we have new and interesting problems from what I grew up with....

The computer has changed the workforce drastically also. I was in Vegas a week or so ago and I was playing one of the last video poker machines that used real money and not computer slips. I hit a hand 4 deuces with a kicker paid 200 bucks and the machine stopped paying. I waited as a man came over and had to refill the machine with quarters.

We talked about the old days when women rolled carts around with lots of change and workers were everywhere attending machines. He said there had been a 85% loss of floor workers with the new computer printed paper slip payouts.

 

I don't think Obama really wanted to threaten to take SS checks away. He was just trying to get congress to come up with a solution on time.

 

Automation has as well, robotics can perform repeated and identical tasks with virtually no errors. Factory floors in modern automated plants are eerily free of humans, just a few strolling around making sure that the machines are running properly.

 

I guess what is even more scary is where those robotic machines you are talking about are built other robotic machines are making them....

I wonder where all this is going and I do not see employment figures getting any better anytime soon.

I do not think we can keep comparing today with 1936. (just in case DL wants to chime in)

 

I think he was using that to prod congress along also but that's not where my problem lies.

Obama was pretty fast to throw the seniors under the bus when he said he was willing to make cuts to medicare and social security for more taxes. I mean it was the first thing he offered...

He's running for re-election and that's all that matters to him. He's thrown medical marijuana patients under the bus also. There's more raids happening now than when Bush was president.

California is now looking at an alternative democrat contender.

 

To me Obama is looking more and more like a one termer if a viable contender shows up. Seems to be a black Carter....

 

When I document how well Democratic economic policies worked as recently as the Clinton administration I am told that the past is no guide to the present. Well, economics is not an exact science. Nevertheless, the past is our only guide to what might work now.

Conservatives are supposed to respect the past, and tradition. I do.

I also respect the record of what did not work in the past. Ronald Reagan's 1980 assertion that tax cuts generate more tax revenue than tax increases was a very unconservative assertion. It was also proven to be false. Unfortunately, Republicans continue to believe it for no other reason than that they want to.

When President Clinton raised the top tax rate Republicans predicted dire results. Instead, we got eight years of broadly based economic growth culminating with a balanced budget and the lowest unemployment rate since the late 1960s.

Those who claim that Democratic policies that worked in the past will fail in the future do so because they want them to fail. This is because they like the idea of an economy where wealth continues to be concentrated at the top, while everyone else declines. They like this idea because they are at the top, because they think - however irrationally - that they will get there, or because they simply like and admire rich people.

These same people believe passionately that Republican policies that failed in the past will succeed in the future.

This is what I would like to do. I am not claiming infallibility. I do not know that my recommendations would have the desired effect. Even Karl Marx said, "I am glad that I am not a Marxist." He denied the infallibility often claimed on his behalf by his followers. In economics, little can be precisely known, and nothing can be precisely predicted.

First, I would like to repeal the North American Free Trade Agreement. It was signed in 1994 by President Clinton, but with more Republican support in Congress than Democrat support. I think it should be obvious that Ross Perot's prediction of "a giant sucking sound" of jobs leaving the United States has been vindicated.

Second, I would restrict legal immigration, and begin a vigorous crackdown on illegal immigrants. These efforts would include severe penalties for employers who hire illegals.

If we restricted immigration to whites from Europe, Orientals, and a few Indians, we would solve the problem of employers importing cheap labor, because few whites from Europe and few Orientals want to move here.

Third, I would solve the problem of long term unemployment by shortening the work week. There was a time when most Americans worked twelve hours a day, six days a week. A thirty hour work week sounds fine to me.

Once it becomes more difficult for employers to export good jobs while importing cheap labor, it will be easier to raise wages through a high minimum wage, and strong labor unions.

Finally, we should acknowledge that capitalism increasingly favors capital at the expense of labor, and the supremely talented at the expense of everyone else. This problem can be solved by a well financed public sector of the economy paid for by steeply progressive taxation. How progressive? Very progressive.

During the New Deal the top tax rate rose from 63 percent in 1932 to 94 percent in 1944. A high top tax rate would make even more sense now. Everyone lost ground during the Great Depression. The rich lost during the stock market crash of 1929. Many lost everything. Currently America's rich are richer than ever before.

 

That is called gov't interference in the job markets creating a dearth of opportunities. Marxist v Austrian Economics, one is based on wishful thinking and the other is based on what actually happens.

Stop listening to the honeyed lie! These are the same bureaucrats who can't even run a Department of Motor Vehicles, and yet people insists that they have the brain power to mastermind the whole economy?

It SOUNDS very nice to have all these honeyed promises like 'perpetual growth', 'cheap housing for all', 'guaranteed jobs', 'health care and retirement 'free' for all'. . . but the problem is that ALL of those require either inefficient bureaucrats handling the process (I read somewhere years ago that the US pays something like $1.85 for every dollar it uses as transfer payments to systemic inefficiency = destruction of wealth) OR ruinous regulations that SOUND great until they meet the economic realities where incentives for new 'construction' are removed through rent ceilings, properties deteriorate, and nothing new is built, population outgrows housing, wait times increase, and their is still no incentive for ANYONE to invest in new housing. These programs do EXACTLY the opposite of what they promise.

As far as 'worthless TV' certifications and rubbish like that go. . . Marketing 101 and 'fools and their money are easily parted'. But if you're in a shitty minimum wage job you can go to barber school and learn to cut hair in 6 weeks or whatever it is.

The problem is that when 'you', as the guy stuck in the shit job, tries to 'move' to a new form of employment cutting hair for example, and you run up against 'oppressive business regulations' that same Gov't you praise for taking care of you with it's honeyed lie, is in fact the one TRAPPING YOU in that shitty job because they limit your choices, hampering the economy, and destroying your ability to reach your full potential, ALL just to keep your 'vote' so THEY can have the 'free' and timely Health Care and Employment that they claim to be interested in providing you.

They take today what they promise to share tomorrow. That is the honeyed lie of socialism, because it destroys your opportunities today through inefficiency and 'reallocation', for promises tomorrow. Promises aren't worth shit.