So people standing up for their rights are suddenly domestic terrorists, while those of the left who are advocating violent revolution, commit treason, and more crimes by the day and yet remain free are not?

 

What right?? Bet you can't answer that one there can you big guy? The "right" to graze his cattle for free on the land everyone else has to pay for and gets an incredible deal to boot? You tell me what right Cliven Bundy has to graze his cattle for free?

Now let's see you do that because I've ridden and walked thousands of acres of BLM land and not once in all those years did I see or even hear of a rancher who didn't know he was getting a really good deal from being allowed to graze his livestock on OUR LAND. And that's what it is. OUR LAND. That land belongs to me and every other citizen of this nation as much as it belongs to him. So are you saying he has a "right" to steal it from us?

And one other thing. Its one thing to be a welfare king rancher with a bunch of domestic terrorists to back him up but what kind of a hypocrite would claim he does not believe in the federal government and then have the outrageous gall to have an American Flag waving behind him?

But since I'm sure you are not capable of entertaining more than one question at a time just stick with the first one. What "right" was Bundy and his pack of domestic terrorists standing up for? And if you can't answer that very simple question then we all know you are nothing more than walking and talking bullshit now don't we?

 

PS And just to call your bluff and show you just how phony you are I'll even stick around here for awhile just to prove you can't and won't answer that very simple question.

 

I think the really dumb one here is the one that thinks the US flag is a symbol representative of the federal government. In too many ways to count, the federal government is the very antithesis of what the flag stands for.

 

What right is Bundy and his pack of domestic terrorists standing up for? Now I told you you were just running your hateful mouth about things you don't even know and we just proved that didn't we?

But since you've already proven that first one let's go ahead and move ahead to your next piece of bullshit right wing false propaganda. Does the "American" flag as you call it stand for the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA OR NOT?

 

Hey M4MPetCock where'd you go. You were all kinds of mouth and know it all a few minutes ago and now what are you doing? Just running and hiding huh?

 

Once again the flame-brained leftists like to twist words and meaning around.

I state that people making a stand for their rights, are suddenly 'domestic terrorists' as declared by Reid, the Department of Homeland Security, most of the admin, and most of the left. As usual, you go and twist words around.

People make a stand against the growing tyranny and power-hungry administration, the ambitions of Harry Reid, and more. "Bundy' is making a stand for what he believes in, and if he has broken laws, then why was he not arrested from the beginning? Why did the BLM decide to bring heavily armed forces into play? Why did they have snipers at the ready to take down an unarmed man?

Why did the BLM cowboys chase some of his cattle to death, and shot at least two of them deliberately?

Suddenly to flame-brains people of the left there is no one save for them who have the right to self-expression, to state their opinions, and to make their own choices, of which, if they do violate the law, they must be prepared to face the justice system.

If you bothered to listen to the entire mass of Bundy's statements, he holds to the Constitution, and to STATE rights, and holds the BLM illegally holds the land in its possession when, to him, the STATE should control it, and not the FEDERAL government.

Now as to the flag, he has the right to stand before it, or has that been revoked for non-leftist extremists in this land?

Why do you not become enraged at the administration who deems those who want limited government, more freedom with accountability and responsibility, balanced budgets, and tackling of the national debt, being deemed 'domestic terrorists'?

Why do you not become enraged at the daily criminal actions undertaken by the admin, by Reid, and by so many others?

You dared me to respond, implying that I am a coward when you stated I would not. So I am calling your bluff, and using my right to expression to present my opinion.

Respect it or not,
Complain about it or not,
But we both have the same freedom of expression, under the same Constitution, that the left and the admin is constantly undermining.

 

The flag represents the ENTIRE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, something the current administration would love to have people forget and never recall.

 

Wow, dude. What a picture that statement paints. I'm seeing someone sitting in front of his PC, clicking the refresh button constantly, going "Come on, damn it. Reply so I can pounce." (refresh...refresh...refresh) "Yeah, he's running scared. (refresh...refresh...refresh) "I knew it...punk." (refresh, refresh,refresh) While I, on the other hand, am in the living room, watching Jeopardy like just about every other night during the week, blissfully ignorant of your requirement that all of your posts MUST receive a reply within the timeframe mandated by none other than the great and powerful Stumbler Oz.

Let me save you some of that anguish for future reference. I might come to the forum several times over the course of my day. Lots of times, I'll read the threads that interest me, maybe post a couple of comments, then walk away and go about my day. For instance, as soon as I post this comment, I'll be going back to said living room to watch the Sox game. So if you reply, rest assured that your comment will still be there tomorrow.

Anyway, do you pledge allegiance to the United States of America? Or do you pledge allegiance to the Federal Government? I will apologize for not wording my statement more carefully. I should have said "today's" or "this" federal government. Because the federal government of the past few decades in no way resembles that which was created by the Constitution. The flag is a symbol of freedom and liberty. I think the people who should be ashamed are the politicians in DC, including the current occupier of the White House, whose actions are nothing even close tho what the US flag was meant to symbolize.

 

How can asking you what "right" Bundy and his pack of armed domestic terrorists are standing up for twist yours or anyone elses words?

You tell me that?

Once again what "rights" are they standing up for? See how phony you really are? You make this statement and can't even back it up.

Couple of real simple questions you can't and won't answer because you are just running your hateful mouth. Were some of Bundy's supporters on an over pass in sniper positions aiming their guns on federal employees just trying to keep the peace and do their jobs? We the women and kids of these supporters being used as human shields on the front lines or not? Answer those really simple questions or once again prove all you can do is run your mouth spouting false right wing propaganda.

So you're saying the original Taylor Grazing Act from 1934 was party of this growing tyranny and power hungry administration? Barack Obama wasn't even born then. But I will tell you this. That same Taylor Grazing Act saved my Great Grandfathers ranch and is the reason my family is still ranching to this very day and know they get a God Damned good deal out of it.

Was Bundy convicted of breaking the laws in numerous courts of law or not? That's another one you can't and won't answer isn't it because you don't have the faintest idea what you are talking about which is just painfully obvious.

Because this government and administration is not as tyrannical as you claim it is and they took civil proceedings first.

They didn't and you are simply lying about this. They had the county law enforcement. It was Bundy who had the armed forces backing him up.

Again you totally lie you complete know nothing phony. Check the pictures. It was the Bundy supporters who took up sniper positions against federal employees just trying to do their jobs.

They didn't.. And you are simply lying again because you believe phony propaganda.

Because they were range bulls and actually pretty dangerous to work with. You never saw a live cow in your life have you? Just more totally phony bullshitting om your part.

Really?? Unless you live in Colorado or Washington step out on the street and light up a joint and then tell be about not having to face justice.

But let me ask you this? What about all those landowners in the route of the Keystone Pipeline who don't owe a million dollars in fees, own their land outright and don't want the Keystone Pipeline to cross their land? Surly you support their "rights" to don't you? Shouldn't they be able to stop the Keystone Pipeline?

That's an absolute lie and you are a liar. Bundy claims he does not recognize the Federal Government. The same federal government that bought all that land in 1803 with the Lousianna Purchase. Where did you think all this "federal" land came from you total fraud?

Belive me I'm laughing right in your face at this point and can prove that by asking you just another really simple question. Currently Bundy would have to pay about $1.35 per acre to lease federal land. Now if it was "state's rights" and Bundy had to pay the state of Nevada how much would he have to pay to lease "state" land? You don't have a clue do you total fraud? So I'll answer that for you. It would be more than $6 per acre you phony.

First anyone who does not recognize the federal government of this nation has no right to even display the flag that represents it because he (and you) are spitting all over everything it stands for. And secondly and more importantly that is not HIS LAND. That is public land and belongs to me and every other citizen of this nation as much as it belongs to him.

Does Bundy also own all our national parks and forests just because he says so you traitor?

Now this doesn't have a damn thing to do with what we are talking about or your completely phony claim that Bundy and his pack of domestic terrorists were standing up for Budny's rights now does it you hysterical fraud? Not one bit. Just like you try to accuse liberals its actually you that has to twist words around and come up with something totally meaningless. You gutless and blind hypocrite.

Because requiring people to pay for grazing their livestock on public land is not criminal. Refusing to pay those federal fees is criminal and robs all the rest of us.

No you gutless and phony coward I did not dare you to just respond. I specifically challenged you to back up your statement that Bundy and his pack of domestic terrorists were standing up for their "rights" and you were too gutless and cowardly to even address it so I will ask it again just to prove it again. WHAT RIGHTS WERE THEY STANDING UP FOR? The right to free load off of all the rest of us? The right to gain an economic advantage over every other rancher in this country by not paying the fees all the rest of them do? You chickenshit dodger you couldn't and wouldn't even try that would you phony non-fucker.

NOT you blow hard fraud.

I'm not complaining one bit. I'm simply pointing out what a total know nothing loud mouthed fraud you really are.

Does that "freedom of expression" include defrauding the American people by gaining a million dollar advantage by grazing your cattle for free?

And you never read our constitution. Don't have the faintest idea what it says or what it represents. And obviously hate the United States of America and everything it stands for. So all I can say about that is if you hate this country so much leave it.

 

@Stumbler:

You clearly demonstrate the fanatical ramblings of the left, especially when their arguments have been completely defeated by logic, common sense, and truth.

You have lost, admit it, accept it, get over it.

The debate is over.

 

.

 

Shooter needs to clarify something.
The issue with Bundy not paying BLM fees to graze his cattle goes back many years.

Back to when area ranchers paid Clark County, or the State of Nevada, grazing fees.

Cause back then, most of that land was state land, not BLM land.

For reasons I STILL don't know, BLM grabbed the land. Some say it was to "protect" the dessert tortise. Others say it was for the mineral rights. In any case, they grabbed the land.

Master Bundy took exception to the land grab, declined to sign agreements with BLM to graze his cattle, and continued to pay Clark County the fees he had agreed to before BLM showed up.

BLM eventually took him to court, which agreed that Master Bundy was a bit off the mark, and did indeed owe BLM $1Million in grazing fees, penalties, and interest.

Leading eventually to the BLM/Bundy crisis.

You can point to Bundy as a crazed Nevada rancher who has a curious view of the way governments should work, but he ain't a terrorist. The groups jumping to his aid surely are as guilty of grabbing an incident for their own purposes as the good reverend Sharpton.

Shame on them.

But Shooter is glad the mess has shined a light on Reid and his cronies and their little rats nest of corruption.

 

OK, so the focus of this thread has shifted slightly. But that's not a complaint. In rolling with the flow, it's still got a Nevada focus. So...

http://www.providencejournal.com/opinion/commentary/20140419-jay-ambrose-the-feds-are-coming-the-feds-are-coming.ece


The feds are coming, the feds are coming




Here comes Cliven Bundy, who looked like a 21st-century Paul Revere as he ran about his Nevada ranch shouting the feds are coming, the feds are coming, successfully arousing others who joined him in standing up to a mighty force that backed down in some of its overkill. Is he a hero, then? No, but stay tuned.

He’s not a hero because, as others note, he is disobeying the law by not paying federal fees for use of land he says does not belong to the federal government. It does belong to the federal government. What’s more, armed militia members were part of a protest on Bundy’s behalf, and that disgusts me. I abhor the whole militia idea. Please keep those guys away.

It can also be said, however, that Bundy has pointed a finger at real wrongs, including the government’s own refusal to obey the law. I would even say his situation bears some slight resemblance to issues the colonists confronted when the British Empire said, look, the French and Indian War cost a lot of money, you Americans need to pay more and we’re not waiting for Paul Revere or anyone else to volunteer his cash.

Remember that the British encouraged development in the colonies and afforded settlers a sometimes spotty but relatively high degree of self-government. Then, in the late 18th century as its coffers were beginning to look embarrassingly bare, the Brits started throwing some heavy taxes at colonists who had no parliamentary representatives. When they protested too vehemently, the British officials clamped down on their liberties. It was like first saying you are mostly free, then that you are a lot less free and finally that you haven’t seen anything yet, all of which led to the Declaration of Independence.

Similarly, as the lawyer-manned Power Line blog site tells us, the federal government in the 19th century said, hey, we’d like some ranching in Nevada and guess what: We’ll let your cattle graze for free on federal land. Bundy’s forebears arrived in the 1870s and all went well. Then, much later, something else came along, the Bureau of Land Management, which eventually got cozy with radical environmentalists as it started implementing rules that gave cows less grazing space and fees that cost scads of ranchers their ranches. Bundy, wanting to keep his, has said no to the fees since 1993.

The bureau, which aims to protect the desert tortoise even as it encourages Nevada solar-power projects that endanger the desert tortoise, recently decided it wasn’t going to stand for this. It sent rangers out to round up Bundy’s cattle along with armed officers to surround the ranch. It restricted protesters to a narrow free-speech zone. Ex-Judge Andrew Napolitano, a positive force for rule of law, has pointed out on TV that the government reaction was “draconian, authoritarian” and that parts of it were illegal. There is at least this to be said. The government stopped short of a tragic travesty that could have resembled the 1993 horror in Waco, Texas, when four federal agents and 82 men, women and children belonging to a religious cult were killed. The bureau let the cattle go. It retreated for the time being.

The message to the nation of all of this? Namely that the federal government is here, there and everywhere, is always expanding its reach, intrudes much, much too much, limits opportunity even as it preaches opportunity and itself is ever more lax about heeding the law.

When President Barack Obama shrugs his shoulders at constitutional restrictions, what example exactly is he setting? I suggest that in the midterm 2014 elections, we have a voting booth uprising favoring candidates who believe in adherence to law and governmental limits.

 

On a side note, look how close, date wise, the situation came to the anniversary of Waco, along with the anniversaries of some other high-profile events.

 

As American Indians will tell you the US government is all about breaking promises and treaties.

 

Now this is a hint of some good news;

Western states hold summit on controlling federal land, say 'It's simply time

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...taking-control-federal-lands/?intcmp=HPBucket

 

Domestic Terrorists?
Or a well regulated armed militia necessary to the security of a free state against an out of control federal government.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCxUgr-wJG8

Can see why the government wants to scrap the 2nd Amendment. It prevents the government from doing what they want.

 

Also, the inherit right to self-defense is another reason the Federal government, especially the left, is desperate to disarm the populace and negate the 2nd Amendment.

 

OH YEAH,,,words straight out of the mouth of a tyrannical leftist.