Ok going back to explaining religion. My belief in God gives me strength I need to my job. He is always there to help me through the tough times. All I can say is that from what I have gone through in my life and what I have done God has been by my side to help me through every moment of it.

 

seriously, if we where to ever meet in person i would punch you square in the fucking face.

 

yea and I'd kick the shit out of you

don't fuck with a real man, boy

 

Atheists are under no obligation to prove anything or provide any kind of evidence, since they in fact make no positive assertion. It is the religious believers who make a positive assertion regarding the existence of God, namely, that he/she exists. If someone makes such a claim, it is only fair or to be expected that others may require evidence before simply accepting such a claim at face value.

Let's try an experiment. Let's replace the word "god" with the word "unicorn." Here's how the conversation might go:

Unicorn believer: Unicorns exist.

Potential Unicorn convert: What, how do you know?

Unicorn believer: I read it in a book that was written by unicorns that tells me that unicorns in fact exist.

Potential Unicorn Convert: But how do you know that this book was actually written by unicorns?

Unicorn Believer: Why, because the book says so! (or, alternatively, it gives me comfort to believe in unicorns, I received a direct revelation from unicorns, it just makes sense to me that unicorns must exist, unicorns give meaning and purpose to my life, etc.)

You get the idea. The atheist need not prove anything, only say that there is not enough evidence to demonstrate the claim that God (unicorns, spaghetti Monsters, giant green Iguanas in the sky) exists.

 

Yea well the thing that you don't get is that we don't try to prove that our God exists, we just believe in him. Then annoying intolerant atheists have to try to convince us that God doesn't exist and call us ignorant and dumb and whatever else you want.

So if you're going to mock my beliefs, show me some damn proof that God does not exist or shut the fuck up

 

Thank you very much, Spirit.Lotus, for answering my post. I don't ever want to come across as intolerant or unfair, but I do think that in a discussion there is room for disagreement. I apologize if I put you at an unfair advantage with the quotation, but I had recently been reading the book and when I saw your post it just seemed so relevant that I had to give the quotation.

I agree with you that "matter" is neither created nor destroyed. I just have a problem believing that consciousness outlives the brain or body. Yes, absolutely, in a sense we are all a part of everything, since the matter that composes our bodies can feed the fish that then feed other animals, etc. This does not mean, however, that consciousness outlives the life of the conscious living being.

By the way, I absolutely LOVE your signature by Rumi. He is a magnificent poet.

 

I HAVE TO SAY IT. There are thousands and maybe more people that have died completely and gone to the other world and come back, how can you say in the face of the solid evidence (you think they all make up the same lie when they dont even know each other, and from all over the world) that you have a problem believe that WE go on and are not just our bodies. If this isn't PROOF then there never can be. I know personally of 3 other people besides myself.

I am not deriding your belief in this, but hopefully the evidence will make you more secure in that you aint just gonna be no more. I could give you a bibliography of cases investigated scientifically.

 

I have NEVER tried to disprove the existence of God; neither do I find myself simply able to "just believe" in that which no one can prove exists. Once again, the burden of proof is upon those who assert, not those who deny. For the record, I don't believe I've ever called anyone ignorant, or dumb. I do think it is a fair question to ask, though: If you believe, what evidence do you have for your belief? I have devout Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses pounding on my door incessantly wanting an opportunity to prove to me why THEIR particular god is the one true God, and why I need Him in my life.

 

oh and pornluver, sorry if I'm coming off a bit harsh, I'm just trying to explain to you that everytime somebody goes trying to tell people what they should believe or not believe on the forum, it's an atheist

well obviously this post was too late, I wasn't saying you particularly mocked my beliefs, but quite a few have

 

What does it look like on the other side? Does everyone go there? Animals to? Or just people? Plants? What is your version of this other world, and how does it compare to the otherworld experience of all the saints and mystics of countless religious traditions who have experienced this otherworld very differently? Or is it purely subjective?

 

Thanks for the clarification, Baller.

 

I am a Theist.

For the longest time, I thought I was Atheist, then after taking with one of my friend's father (who is an Anglican Priest) I was told I was Agnostic, so for a period of two or three years, I was Agnostic. Then, after a lesson in a philosophy class, I actually determined that I was a Theist.

For those of you that don't know, a Theist believes in a higher power, that there is something out there, but it may not necessarily be God.

There are a great many things that can be explained away by science. Then there are somethings that are much harder to explain. Like the wrappers on processed cheese slices for example, some sort of divine power had a hand in making those bad boys, let me tell you. Anyway, I've had many a discussion with the devoutly, Christian, Catholic, etc, etc, (which I have no problem with, as long as they, in the words of George Carlin "Keep Thy Religion to Thyselves".) Who have always said to me, "but if you don't except Jesus into your life, you won't get into heaven," to which I say, "Assuming there is a Heaven, and assuming I get there when I die, God and I can have a discussion about my belief system when I get there, I think as long as I don't eat babies and sodomize kittens for the rest of my life, he'll understand.

Actually, there is one thing I should say before I go, when I said that I was tolerant of all religions, I lied. I absolutely, 100% refuse to have religious discussions, or dealings with Pagans, Wiccans and Scientologists. The first two are just dirty, stinky hippies with delusions of grandeur, and Scientology is a cult, a money grabbing cult, so there, I'm done.

 

I don't. I think that organized religion causes more problems than it solves. I'd take up Buddhism but I don't think I could give up eating meat.

 

I don't know how many are like me, but I personally just enjoy talking about it. My goal isn't really to convince. I have tried to curb my discussion on it lately though because it is obvious that it has started to irritate many of the christians here.

 

When reading between the lines it already was.

 

Dirty Stinky hippies, are we: I have NEVER been a hippie. You need to get some education about which you speak, obviously from ignorance about some things.
Delusions of grandeur, just show me one, you must realize that all NON CHRISTIANS are PAGANS by definition. All non-mormons are gentiles, all non-jews are gentiles, all non-muslims are infidels. You didn't have to make an insulting post you know. No one is insulting you, are they?.
\
Oh shit, you are only 21, no wonder.

 

Afterword

Maybe you should think about reading what people have experienced after dying and coming back, and also what psychiatrists have discovered thru hynotic trances about what happens between lives. But I am sure you dont even know the books exist.

 

https://apocalypsewill.blogspot.com/

 

This is pretty much garbage. I think the atheist vs morality, the thread about being slaves to our brains and a few others have given ample evidence and reason that being good need not be linked to a deity.

Letters and dildo factories are listed as evidence of a god. Can he really be serious? Yes we have an advantage over other animals; it is quite a leap to then say we much be a chosen species in favor with a higher being. He states there is no link between humans and monkeys. Since he failed to even distinguish between monkeys and apes I’m willing to bet he hasn’t spent any real time studying phylogeny.

He states you won’t hear any preaching from him, yet his entire poorly written discourse was a failed attempt to preach. It is funny that despite his previous implication that fear of judgment is the sole reason to behave well, he has no fear of reprisal in calling the bulk of believers brain dead assholes.

This guy obviously toes that delicate line making him one of the few truly enlightened and sacred ones.

 

Since we'll all posting links, I think this one is a tad better than the other one posted.

Foreword: I really dig this article. I read it almost a year and a half ago now, and a lot of it (not all) rings pretty true with me. It deals directly with the problem of evil and the sufferings of life and why these are the primary reasons thiests do not believe in god (usually).

So, read it for yourself You might like it, you might not. But hey, you're learning something! *maybe*

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Problem_of_evil