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  1. Rixer

    Rixer Horndog

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Just for your information, the wife was able to retire early because of ACA.

    Her employer provided insurance was over $1000 per month. She quit and went on ACA for a fraction of the cost. Yay....woo-hoo what a country! :happy:

    I love it when a plan comes together.
     
    • Like Like x 4
    #21
  2. Distant Lover

    Distant Lover Master of Facts

    Joined:
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    59,192
    Those who are in automobile accidents, and who are gunshot victims require stays in hospitals that are frequently long and expensive. Their lives are in danger of they cannot pay for this.
     
    1. Viewer1060
      I have a large extended family thus as family members were in hospital. We got them home as soon as possible to rest from the ordeal and recover. Sadly in the 21st Century we to place our dying friends and family in hospital rather than dying at home. None of us have external life on planet earth.

      For 10,000 years or more we died at home not among strangers in a cold noisy impersonal institution. Did that 64 year old millionaire have end stage blood cancer ? Was it a strange and twisted Death By Cop ? That was Las Vegas, NV. and we still do not know why he killed strangers.
       
      Viewer1060, Oct 15, 2017
    #22
  3. Distant Lover

    Distant Lover Master of Facts

    Joined:
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    Republicans do not want domestic spending programs to be effective and popular.

    This is what William Kristol wrote in a 1993 memo to Republican leaders about the Clinton health care plan:

    ----------

    MEMORANDUM TO: REPUBLICAN LEADERS
    FROM: WILLIAM KRISTOL
    SUBJECT: Defeating President Clinton’s Health Care Proposal

    its passage in the short run will do nothing to hurt (and everything to help) Democratic electoral prospects in 1996. But the long-term political effects of a successful Clinton health care bill will be even worse–much worse. It will relegitimize middle-class dependence for “security” on government spending and regulation. It will revive the reputation of the party that spends and regulates, the Democrats, as the generous protector of middle-class interests. And it will at the same time strike a punishing blow against Republican claims to defend the middle class by restraining government.
     
    1. shootersa
      Yes indeed; There's the fundamental problem with government health care;
      "It will relegitimize middle-class dependence for “security” on government spending and regulation."​
      The one sure way to fuck up a good thing is let the Government get involved in it.
       
      shootersa, Oct 16, 2017
    #23
  4. ace's n 8's

    ace's n 8's Porn Star

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    Ever hear of DOA?
     
    #24
  5. ace's n 8's

    ace's n 8's Porn Star

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    Socialized medicine is popular, but unconstitutional, unless a POTUS has a stacked SCOTUS that ruled Social Security as Constitutional, then another socialist POTUS adds another amendment and calls it Medicare.

    Truman wanted more social programs too, his congress wasn't having it.
     
    1. View previous comments...
    2. ridgerunner
      its not socialism fuckwit
      its going back to what was written by the founders of the nation that disallowed a profitable industry to control the medical care of the people
       
      ridgerunner, Oct 16, 2017
      Distant Lover likes this.
    3. ace's n 8's
      It is in fact socialism....

      ...and, show me the proof of that.
       
      ace's n 8's, Oct 16, 2017
    4. ridgerunner
      In 1973, Nixon did a personal favor for his friend and campaign financier, Edgar Kaiser, then president and chairman of Kaiser-Permanente. Nixon signed into law, the Health Maintenance Organization Act of 1973, in which medical insurance agencies, hospitals, clinics and even doctors, could begin functioning as for-profit business entities instead of the service organizations they were intended to be. And which insurance company got the first taste of federal subsidies to implement HMOA73 … *gasp* … why, it was Kaiser-Permanente! What are the odds? It’s all right here to read for yourself.
       
      ridgerunner, Oct 16, 2017
      Distant Lover likes this.
    5. ace's n 8's
      I didn't need proof of that, Kennedy introduced that bill, it was Kennedy that was doing the favor, not Nixon.

      I want proof of your claim;

      ''its going back to what was written by the founders of the nation that disallowed a profitable industry to control the medical care of the people''

      Try to stay focused.
       
      ace's n 8's, Oct 16, 2017
    6. shootersa
      Ridge, your link is broken, and as Shooter already pointed out; the initial bill sponsored by Ed Kennedy and signed by Nixon required that a "certified HMO" be non profit.
       
      shootersa, Oct 16, 2017
    #25
  6. imported__2355

    imported__2355 Ungodly Intelligent And Attractive

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    Every system has people who will abuse it. Just look at the Secretary for Health and Human Service's travel expenses. But Medicare does one thing no other health care system can do: it operates with only 3% overhead. 97 cents out of every dollar goes to pay health provider 's bills and not into a CEOs pocket.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    1. View previous comments...
    2. deleted user 777 698
      No I do not wonder why. I know why. It is the reason socialism will never be successful in even our grandchildrens lifetimes.
       
      deleted user 777 698, Oct 15, 2017
    3. ace's n 8's
      Bullshit. imported__2355, fraud is committed by the individual, the doctors and the federal fucking government.

      Not to mention, the fucking lobbyists.
       
      ace's n 8's, Oct 16, 2017
    4. imported__2355
      So explain which individual is responsible for the rule forbidding Medicare and Medicaid from using their massive buying power to negotiate lower bulk purchase pricing on covered prescription drugs? That is systematic fraud. A built in rip off of the tax payer. Name the individual who did it and who wont fix it.
       
      imported__2355, Oct 16, 2017
    5. ace's n 8's
      Socialism, what do you expect out of socialistic policies?
       
      ace's n 8's, Oct 16, 2017
    6. shootersa
      It would seem people here are beginning to understand the fundamental purpose of the revolution.
      Net worth at initial election to office.
      Net worth on reelection.
      Ask why.
      Vote accordingly.
       
      shootersa, Oct 16, 2017
    #26
  7. ace's n 8's

    ace's n 8's Porn Star

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    Related: Audit Uncovers $124.7 B of Overpayments and Fraud in Medicare and Medicaid

    In fiscal 2014 alone, 22 agencies approved improper Medicare, Medicaid and Earned Income Tax Credit payments totaling an astounding $124.7 billion—an increase of $18.9 billion or 15 percent from the previous year, according to a new report. Those over-payments accounted for over 75 percent of the estimated government-wide over-payments or improper payments.

    What is the budget for those 2 programs? $500 billion?, that equals roughly 25% in fraud...

    Yet you want to claim that ''97 cents out of every dollar goes to pay health provider 's bills'', the math doesn't add up here.
     
    #27
  8. imported__2355

    imported__2355 Ungodly Intelligent And Attractive

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    Providers who pad their bills don't change the system operating costs. By comparison, Blue Cross-Blue Shield has a 33% overhead cost, meaning only 67 cents of your premiums actually go to pay for Health care. The rest supports its massive corporate staff.
     
    #28
  9. Jdbfromnj

    Jdbfromnj Porn Star

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    Considering I don't have Obamacare, it doesn't affect me at all.
     
    #29
  10. Distant Lover

    Distant Lover Master of Facts

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    Some victims of auto accidents and gun shot wounds die immediately. Most require long stays in hospitals. If they do not have health insurance what do you want to have happen to them?
     
    #30
  11. ace's n 8's

    ace's n 8's Porn Star

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    Those happen to be ''emergency situation'' and will not, by law, be refused emergency medical attention.

    NEXT.

    I'm still looking for the legitimacy on the 45,000 dying annually due to not having health insurance
     
    #31
  12. Bron Zeage

    Bron Zeage I am a river to my people

    Joined:
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    If an accident victim manages to live 24 hours after the ambulance dumps them at the back door, it's no longer an emergency. Even then, it's not as if the hospital likes treating people who can't pay.

    45K deaths due to not having insurance could be a low number. It all depends on how you consider the cause of death. Infant mortality is fairly high in the US. Why not check into how many of those dead babies were born to mothers who had health insurance?

    Heart disease kills a lot of people, but properly managed, a person can live quite a long time. Of course, without health insurance, managing heart disease might be out of reach. Diabetes is a real bitch, because untreated high blood sugar slowly erodes the vascular system, leading to blindness, loss of teeth, and amputation of the lower limbs. People without health insurance don't get much treatment, most of which involves regular lab work and prescriptions.

    Do your research and get back to me on how many illegitimate deaths were due to not having health insurance. It's not as if you would change your mind if you found out it was more than 45,000.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    #32
  13. ace's n 8's

    ace's n 8's Porn Star

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    Which Dr. Seuss hat did you manage to pull this nonsensical bullshit out of?

    It could also be a very high number, just more scare tactics from the leftists.

    The health issue that you have stated here are typically found in the older/retired society, that are covered under Medicare, and private insurance.

    Every study conducted had several limitations, essentially those studies were just throwing monkey shit at the wall, then analyzing the figures and the shadows of the splat.

    Bottom line, there is nothing that remotely proves that 45,000 die annually because of ''lack of health insurance''
     
    #33
  14. Bron Zeage

    Bron Zeage I am a river to my people

    Joined:
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    It's easy to brush off the problem as something only older/retired people need to worry about. After all who cares if a medical issue which begins in a person's 40s and goes untreated, ends in a foot amputation, if it's now a medicare problem.

    As I said, it's not as if new information is of any value to you.
     
    #34
  15. RandyKnight

    RandyKnight Have Gun, Will Travel

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    I felt sorry for a man who had no feet---until I met a man who had never owned a Porsche....
     
    #35
  16. Distant Lover

    Distant Lover Master of Facts

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    Yes indeed; There's the fundamental problem with government health care;
    "It will relegitimize middle-class dependence for “security” on government spending and regulation."
    The one sure way to fuck up a good thing is let the Government get involved in it.

    - shootersa

    -------

    William Kristol disagrees with you. He said domestic spending programs initiated by the Democrats can be well executed, and that when they are they threaten the Republican Party.
     
    1. shootersa
      Well, William Kristol is welcome to his opinion, just as you are.
      Just as Shooter is.

      Government run programs, even those that are popular, like Social Security, never are as efficient as similar programs where Government involvement is eliminated.

      Shooter can't think of a single government program that is as efficient as it's private sector counterpart.
       
      shootersa, Oct 17, 2017
    #36
  17. Distant Lover

    Distant Lover Master of Facts

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    Here it is again:

     
    #37
  18. shootersa

    shootersa Frisky Feline

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    So here's the thing about the study.
    It used data from a survey conducted between 1986 and 1994 by the National Health and Nutrition Survey.
    The researchers used this old data to compare more modern treatment methods and better drugs to determine how many of those participants in the 25 year old survey would have survived today.

    In other words, it's a 25 year old survey that's been retreaded and "discovers" that advances in treatment have lowered mortality rates.

    Perhaps most telling is that the conclusion included a push for single payer health care, noting;
    “Historically, every other developed nation has achieved universal health care through some form of nonprofit national health insurance. Our failure to do so means that all Americans pay higher health care costs, and 45,000 pay with their lives.”
    So, while the updated findings are of interest, once again a little research underscores how critical it is to verify any study quoted by the Dog; he has a tendency to cherry pick his facts, find questionable studies, and use findings out of context to advance his "Government should be all powerful and all giving" agenda.
     
    #38
  19. stumbler

    stumbler Porn Star

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    Dems and GOP say tjey have a fix.
     
    #39
  20. RandyKnight

    RandyKnight Have Gun, Will Travel

    Joined:
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    go back to elk hunting and drinking --- thats what you are good at---even if you are disabled...
     
    #40