News From the Front...

From a Wall St. Journal article today - the Dean of Harvard Medical School on Obamacare:

"As the dean of Harvard Medical School I am frequently asked to comment on the health-reform debate. I'd give it a failing grade."

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704431804574539581994054014.html

 

Health 'Reform' Gets a Failing Grade

"By JEFFREY S. FLIER

"Our health-care system suffers from problems of cost, access and quality, and needs major reform. Tax policy drives employment-based insurance; this begets overinsurance and drives costs upward while creating inequities for the unemployed and self-employed."

--------

Flier acknowledges that there are fundamental problems with America's private health system. It has been documented again and again in this thread that systems of universal health care get better results with less money. If we cannot emulate Western Europe and the British Commonwealth, that is a major flaw in the national character.

 

If we do chose to emulate the Western Europe and British Commonwealth, that would really constitute a major flaw.

Fix the problem areas and get on with the show.

 

That is the problem with the President's health care plan. He is trying to make concessions to those who do not want any plan at all. I distrust untested reforms. Nevertheless, a generation of experience with universal health care systems proves that they work very well. I have proved this in this thread with links that you have not even tried to refute.

 

The only reason you don't think that I have refuted them is that you do not read what someone else posts. You simply go on linking the same old tired articles about how you would like things to be.

Repeatedly myself and others have pointed out to you that the record of our bureaucrats promise nothing but more failure. High costs and mediocre results are the typical results with our government run programs. The record speaks for itself.

 

You argue that Americans are too incompetent to do what Europeans do very well. Then you say that I am unpatriotic.

 

When did I say that you were unpatriotic? I merely stated that in my opinion you are wrong.

The history of our style of government dooms socialistic programs from the gitgo. We do not operate that way, when will you grasp that notion?

 

This is a position unworthy of intelligent discourse. The syllogism goes like this:

Major Premise: The government can't do anything right.
Minor Premise: Universal health care will involve an active role by the government.
Consequent: Universal health care cannot be right.

The problem is, the major premise is patently false. And to the extent that one can find instances of it, one can also find such instances in the private sector. Therefore there's no reason to believe that the government will do a worse job than the private sector.

 

When and if it ever becomes true. Please name what you consider to be "socialistic programs" in the U.S.

 

This is a position unworthy of any type of discourse, intelligent or not. With or without sillygumss.

The idea that denial can trump truth is patently false and pathetically partisan.

To deny that the bureaucrats of the US have done anything but fuck up the programs that exist today, is burying your head in the sand.

 

With all bullshit aside, could you please take a look at what the GOP has offered as a healthcare reform package, then can we talk about that.

Republicans’ Common-Sense Reforms Will LOWER HEALTH CARE COSTS

Americans want a step-by-step, common-sense approach to health care reform, not Speaker Nancy Pelosi’s costly, 1,990-page government takeover of our nation’s health care system. Republicans’ alternative solution focuses on lowering health care premiums for families and small businesses, increasing access to affordable, high-quality care, and promoting healthier lifestyles – without adding to the crushing debt Washington has placed on our children and grandchildren. Following are the key elements of Republicans’ alternative plan:
• Lowering health care premiums. The GOP plan will lower health care premiums for American families and small businesses, addressing Americans’ number-one priority for health care reform.
• Establishing Universal Access Programs to guarantee access to affordable health care for those with pre-existing conditions. The GOP plan creates Universal Access Programs that expand and reform high-risk pools and reinsurance programs to guarantee that all Americans, regardless of pre-existing conditions or past illnesses, have access to affordable care – while lowering costs for all Americans.
• Ending junk lawsuits. The GOP plan would help end costly junk lawsuits and curb defensive medicine by enacting medical liability reforms modeled after the successful state laws of California and Texas.
• Prevents insurers from unjustly cancelling a policy. The GOP plan prohibits an insurer from cancelling a policy unless a person commits fraud or conceals material facts about a health condition.
• Encouraging Small Business Health Plans. The GOP plan gives small businesses the power to pool together and offer health care at lower prices, just as corporations and labor unions do.
• Encouraging innovative state programs. The GOP plan rewards innovation by providing incentive payments to states that reduce premiums and the number of uninsured.
• Allowing Americans to buy insurance across state lines. The GOP plan allows Americans to shop for coverage from coast to coast by allowing Americans living in one state to purchase insurance in another.
• Promoting healthier lifestyles. The GOP plan promotes prevention & wellness by giving employers greater flexibility to financially reward employees who adopt healthier lifestyles.
• Enhancing Health Savings Accounts (HSAs). The GOP plan creates new incentives to save for current and future health care needs by allowing qualified participants to use HSA funds to pay premiums for high deductible health insurance.
• Allowing dependents to remain on their parents’ policies. The GOP plan encourages coverage of young adults on their parents’ insurance through age 25.


Scorecard: Speaker Pelosi’s Government Takeover vs. GOP Common-Sense Solutions


Speaker Pelosi’s Bill
GOP Alternative
Job Losses
Up to 5.5 million
0
Medicare Cuts
$500 billion
0
Tax Increases
$729.5 billion
0
*Updated 11-04-09

http://gopleader.gov/UploadedFiles/...rnative_Health_Care_plan_Updated_11-04-09.pdf

 

Should I point to AIG's near destruction of the global economy, coupled with the necessity of a massive taxpayer bailout to prevent bankruptcy, and use that as the basis for the proposition that private insurance companies cannot be trusted to play a role in the national health care system? That's a much easier position to defend than yours is.

 

Apples and oranges. My point is and has been, that the government has had decades to do things right, they continue to fuck up. From mismanaging military to bank bailouts. Throw in the education mess and you could condemn them foe a century. The AIG thing is actually an example if how the government can't even regulate what they are supposed to be regulating.

 

10 Reasons to Support the Republican Alternative
Taking the First Step. Republicans listened to the American people and have produced a common sense, fiscally responsible health reform proposal—not Speaker Nancy Pelosi’s 2,000+ page government takeover of 1/6th of our nation’s economy. Republicans have a better plan, one that lowers premiums for working families and small businesses, fights fraud, and will lead to expanded access to affordable health care coverage for all Americans without raising taxes, cutting benefits to seniors or spending money we don’t have.
1.
Lowers Health Care Premiums.
According to CBO, the Republican Alternative would reduce health insurance premiums by up to:
•
10% for employees who get coverage through a small business (50 or fewer employees)
•
8% for those who do not have access to employer-provided coverage
•
3% for employees who get coverage through a large business
All told, under the GOP plan, premiums for millions of families would be nearly $5,000 lower than Speaker Pelosi’s cheapest insurance plan, according to CBO estimates.
2.
Guarantees Affordable Coverage for Patients with Preexisting Conditions.
The Republican Alternative makes it illegal for an insurance company to deny coverage to someone with prior coverage on the basis of a pre-existing condition. So if you lose your health insurance because you lose your job, move, get divorced, or just want to change plans, you are protected. Through a new Universal Access Program, all patients with preexisting conditions will have access to affordable health care coverage--without waiting lists. The Republican Alternative also prohibits an insurer from cancelling a policy unless an individually knowingly commits fraud on an application form. It also prohibits insurance plans from instituting annual or lifetime spending limits.
3.
Protects Seniors Medicare Benefits.
Unlike the Pelosi bill, seniors’ benefits are not cut and nothing in the Republican Alternative will increase seniors’ Medicare premiums.
4.
No Tax Increases. Period.
Page 2 of 2
5.
Encourages Small Businesses to Offer Health Care Coverage,
Without Taxing Job Creation.
Unlike the Pelosi bill, which punishes small businesses with onerous mandates and exorbitant taxes that CBO says will be passed on the employees in the form of lower wages, the Republican Alternative plan gives small businesses the power to pool together and offer health care at lower prices, just as corporations and labor unions do.
6.
Enacts Real Medical Liability Reform.
The Republican Alternative saves $54 billion by helping to end costly junk lawsuits and curbing defensive medicine by enacting medical liability reforms modeled after the successful state laws of California and Texas.
7.
Empowers the Doctor- Patient Relationship.
The Republican Alternative eliminates taxpayer funding of a program that could lead to government intrusion in the doctor-patient relationship and the rationing of care on the basis of cost. Unlike the Pelosi bill that increases taxes and expands price controls on medical devices and prescription drugs, the Republican Alternative promotes innovation and places greater emphasis on prevention and wellness.
8.
Prohibits Abortion Funding.
The Republican Alternative explicitly prohibits all federal funds from being used to pay for abortion.
9.
No Entitlement Expansions Forcing Americans onto a Government Run Plan.
The Republican Alternative avoids a dramatic expansion in entitlement spending and reverses pressure to enact enormous additional tax increases in the future, including on the middle class.
10.
Reduces the Deficit.
According to CBO, the Republican Alternative reduces the deficit by $68 billion over the next ten years and continues to reduce the deficit in the second budget window.
For more information, please visit https://HealthCare.GOP.gov.

 

http://gopleader.gov/UploadedFiles/a_tale_of_two_approaches.pdf




GOP Health Care Alternative Helps States Reduce Health Care Costs
November 4, 2009
Republicans believe health care reform should help states, families and small businesses tackle the problem of rising costs. And because health care needs vary from individual to individual, and from state to state, health care reform should increase flexibility for states to develop solutions that fit their needs. A Washington takeover of health care will achieve neither objective. Instead, it will harm states and working families by increasing health care costs and empowering federal bureaucrats to make important decisions that should be left to doctors and patients.
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) is proposing a 2,032-page takeover of health care that will take power away from states, increase state costs by expanding Medicaid, and add at least a $1.3 trillion burden on the American middle class over the next 10 years. It will force states to comply with complex new federal regulations and directives, preventing them from developing health care programs that best fit the needs of their residents, and saddle governors and state legislators with massive unfunded mandates.
House Republicans recognize real solutions start outside the Beltway – and as an alternative to Speaker Pelosi’s government takeover of health care, Republicans are offering a common-sense alternative our nation and states can afford. The GOP alternative recognizes that health care reform must be market-driven, preserve the relationship between doctors and patients, and reduce health care costs for American families. Additionally, Republicans believe health care reform and innovation in the states should be encouraged by Congress, not suffocated by Washington bureaucrats.
A Tale of Two Approaches:
Pelosi Plan
GOP Alternative
Unfunded Mandates on States?
YES. Federal mandated expansion of Medicaid to cost states $34 billion over first ten years according to CBO.
NONE.
Medicaid Coverage Mandates?
YES. Raises threshold for mandatory Medicaid coverage to 150% of FPL ($33,000 per year for a family of four); Requires states now covering above 150% of FPL to maintain eligibility.
NONE.
Foster State Innovation?
NO. In fact, Sec. 2531(a)(4) prohibits states from receiving new incentive payments to adopt liability reforms if they put limits on attorneys’ fees or impose caps on damages.
YES. Gives states the tools to create their own innovative reforms that lower health care costs.
Real Medical Liability Reform?
NO. No real medical liability relief is included.
YES. Implements reforms that will reduce costly, unnecessary
defensive medicine practiced by doctors trying to protect themselves from overzealous trial lawyers.
Pelosi Plan is Chock-Full of Bad News for States:
• In a letter from the Congressional Budget Office (CBO) to House Ways and Means Committee Chairman Rangel on October 29, 2009, CBO “estimates that state spending on Medicaid would increase on net by about $34 billion over the 2010-2019 period.”
• H.R. 3962 grants sweeping powers to a new “Health Care Czar” that will impose new regulations on states and state insurance plans. For example, the federal government will now:
o Regulate all insurance plans, both in and out of the Exchange (Page 127, Section 234);
o Decide which physicians and hospitals participate in the government-run plan and in private plan provider networks (Page 174-178, Section 304(b));
o Determine which states are allowed to operate their own Exchange and to terminate a previously-approved State Exchange at any time (Page 197-202; Section 308); and
o Override state laws regarding covered health benefits (Page 170-171; Section 303(d)).
Republican Alternative Promotes Common-Sense Solutions for States:
• Gives states the tools to create their own innovative reforms that lower health care costs.
• Provides Medicare and Medicaid with additional authority and resources to stop waste, fraud and abuse that costs taxpayers billions of dollars every year.
• Creates new incentives to save for current and future health care needs by allowing qualified participants to use HSA funds to pay premiums for high deductible health insurance.
• Establishes Universal Access Programs to guarantee access to affordable care for those with pre-existing conditions. The GOP alternative creates Universal Access Programs that expand and reform high-risk pools and reinsurance programs to guarantee that all Americans, regardless of pre-existing conditions or past illnesses, have access to affordable care – while lowering costs for all Americans.
• Strengthens employer-provided health coverage by helping uninsured Americans who are eligible for, but not enrolled in, an employer-sponsored plan get health coverage. The plan does this by encouraging employers to move to opt-out, rather than opt-in rules.
• Promotes prevention and wellness by giving employers and insurers greater flexibility to financially reward employees who seek to achieve or maintain a healthy lifestyle.
• Authorizes the creation of health plan finders to provide patients with the tools to easily find the right health plan that best meets their needs.
For more information, please visit http://HealthCare.GOP.gov.
Information on


http://gopleader.gov/UploadedFiles/11-04-09_GOP_Health_Care_Alternative_-_Life.pdf


http://republicans.waysandmeans.hou..._Healthcare_Reform_and__Affordability_Act.pdf

 

Oh for Christ's sake Ace, I'm busy tonight and only skimmed over your latest contribution. But when you conservative/Republicans aren't trying to block health care reform one of your next most favorite targets to bitch about with the public school system. Admittedly in lags behind several other nations. But why? I'll tell you why. Because we've left public education up to the states and so educational standards and curriculum range all the way from good down to God awful terrible.

That's what health care is now for Christ's sake Ace. Most of it is left up to the states. What the republicans are proposing won't help anyone other than the insurance companies.

Now I gotta get back to work.

 

(Ok I lied).

Bullshit tenguy. You damn right the Government has fucked up. The question is has our government fucked up more than capitalism and the free market. Fuck no the Government hasn't. If the Government had fucked up that bad it would have been the government going to the bankers, lenders, hedge fund managers and stock brokers for money instead of the other way around.

Government has a lot of flaws. But not as many flaws as the people government is supposed to serve.

 

to logical for any one to take notice of Kimiko

 

News From The Front

Reid's Senate bill is another 2,000 page, $2,500,000,000,000 turkey:

http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=YTRjNGQyOTQ3ZGY3YmFjNjJiMjJjOGI1YjhmZDNlYmE=

I guess this is the express train to soviet-style socialism. Not only does it spread the suffering of poor health care to all, but it bankrupts the country, something it took the Soviets decades to accomplish in their homeland.

Oh, and by the way - if it passes, there will still be 24,000,000 Americans with no health insurance.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UQ1hw2bkdA&feature=fvw