the cost of living was not as high then, also there are way more types of taxation now. in the 50's you didnt have every swinging dick in the government trying to fuck you out of everything you have, like we do now

 

Well here's a later survey and since its from the right leaning Rasmussen I'm sure you'll love it and swear on your Bible to its accuracy.

It says 48% support the Republican Governor and only 38% support the unions. But there is another 14% who are undecided and that's the whole point of the protests. Show and educate that remaining 14% about what the bill is really about; busting the teachers and public employee unions.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/pub...overnor_in_wisconsin_spat_38_side_with_unions

I believe once they see what the Governor is really trying to do support for the unions will grow.

Who's the one talking in circles then? That would be you. I just posted the latest poll from Rasmussen. But remember your own words. Those numbers are bound to change.

Especially now that what the Governor is really trying to do is becoming better known and better reported on.

And it is absolutely meaningless other than remarkable in the diversity.

But if you're trying to claim President Obama has made special deals for his top campaign contributor you'd have to be a fool to think you showed that.

The real problem is however as I've already pointed out, you're actually far too ignorant and brainwashed to discuss this intelligently, because you don't even know what caused the financial crisis or even when.

So try learning about AIG, "too big to fail" and when the bailouts started.

From

• SEPTEMBER 16, 2008

U.S. to Take Over AIG in $85 Billion Bailout; Central Banks Inject Cash as Credit Dries Up

Emergency Loan Effectively Gives Government Control of Insurer; Historic Move Would Cap 10 Days That Reshaped U.S. Finance

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122156561931242905.html

President Bush and the Republicans controlled both houses of congress for the first six years of his term. By the time the democrats took over the house there were only two years left of his term and the damage had been done, the economy looted, and economic collapse unavoidable.

No what President Obama did was create an stimulus package to stop the economic free fall and avoid another great depression. And President Obama also stopped the lie and spend policies of George Bush and the so called conservative/Republicans by putting all expenses on the Federal Budget.

But because you only know what the right wing noise machine washes your brain with you didn't know that Bush was fighting two wars and the expenses of those wars were not on the Federal Budget.

President Obama inherited those problems from the failed policies of Bush.

Nope that's bullshit. The subprime loans would have hurt some banks but it was not the loans that caused the crises and economic collapse.

No that was caused by what the ratings companies did with those loans that went in in bundles of high risk loans and came out with Triple A credit ratings.

http://www.istockanalyst.com/article/viewarticle/articleid/4055649

And:

Read more: http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2010/04/22/92709/senate-panel-ratings-agencies.html#ixzz1EcdwsCoJ
​

No one forced anyone.

Read more: http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2010/04/22/92709/senate-panel-ratings-agencies.html#ixzz1EceRlAQg
​

Bullshit on two counts. First it was the conservative/Republicans who caused the massive deficits in the first place with tax cuts, two wars kept off the budget, and expansion of government.

Second, the Republicans were swept into office because we have a 9.5% unemployment rate and the American public wants job creation. And a year and half from now when there is still no new job creation they will vote the Democrats back in.

Because the American people do rightfully expect their government to be able to solve their problems.

This from someone who supports the defrauding of the American people to the tune of $13 TRILLION for insurers, bankers and stock brokers.

I firmly believe the people of Wisconsin are legally exercising their rights and that the majority of people in Wisconsin are going to support them for it.

That's why they had more than 50,000 protesters there while the Tea Party counter protest had about 2,000.

Only a fool would believe that the problems at the US manufacturers was caused by the people who put the cars together instead of the over paid management that designed cars nobody wanted to buy and flew their private corporate jets into hearings to have the government bail them out.

And in the meantime it was actually the concessions made by the UAW that allowed them to come up with something that would work.

And work it did. US cars are now competitive on the world market and the auto manufactures are adding more jobs and paying back their loans.

No if I hate anything its the lie of conservatism as it is preached and practiced in this nation.

Where wealthy individuals and corporations can loot and collapse our economy and then run to the government to get bailed out by the Tax payers.

It happens every time the conservative/Republicans are in power and I get sick of so many people being fooled by that.

How dramatic. The unions holding the knife to the throat of the taxpayers. I sure don't feel no knife at my throat. On the other hand I do feel pain. All day everyday from working in unsafe work places because in my right to work state you can't even sue your employer.

I'm a big supporter of unions after that and especially teachers unions, because that's the only thing that protects dedicated professionals from the whims of Governors and School board members.

We will see about that. But at least I'm encouraged that this got lots of national attention and protest. Because its going to be a long hard fight to keep the Koch brother's stooges from destroying a good and beneficial part of our American heritage; labor unions.

Not at all. But I don't find you all that personally impressive. Your education is obviously faulty and you sure seem awful pissed off all the time. So it obviously doesn't make you happy.

As for me I started with nothing, living and working on my own since I was 16 years-old so some pup like you claiming to have worked for something doesn't impress me.

I bet you never went hungry or cold a day in your pampered government subsidized life.

Nope that's actually been rated a Pants On Fire Lie and once again you're too brainwashed to really even discuss these things.

Here's why Governor Walker (and you by extension) are lying.

http://www.politifact.com/wisconsin...sin-gov-scott-walker-says-his-budget-repair-/

You really are a scatter brain aren't you? What does either of these two disconnected things have to do with my statement that our rights, which includes joining unions, are worth standing up for?

Nothing. You just babble along like a brainwashed little brook.

But let me repeat it one more time. Yes we should stand up for our rights. And its really funny in a sickening sort of way to watch the conservative/Republican/Tea Party hypocrisy glare brighter than the sun.

When they wanted to protest by screaming speakers down, using violent and racist rhetoric, and even carrying guns to public meeting you guys called them patriots.

But you let people who have to work for a living do that and they are villainous traitors, tugs, and in your words rapist.

What obvious phonies you really are.

A single judge's ruling can stand, but usually don't because the government especially will use the court system and appeals process.

All presidential administrations have done that.

But let me point out another glaring example of your ignorance and hypocrisy.

I didn't hear any of you conservatives screaming to let gays serve openly in the military when a federal judge ruled Don't Ask, Don't Tell unconstitutional.

And some in fact applauded when the Obama Administration immediately filed for a stay of the judge's orders while they filed an appeal.

That was after President Obama is on record several places as saying he supports repeal of DADT. But he's still the president and that was the law passed so he had do everything in his power to preserve that law.

Congress passes laws and the president has to enforce them. Same with health care laws passed by congress.

Also, no the ruling and even contempt citation by judge Martin Feldman is particularly meaningless. Aside from Feldman's obvious conflict of interest and the favoritism he is showing to the oil companies, there's not a hell of a lot he can do except bitch at this point.

And the government will respond. But probably not until they know for sure what happened in the worst environmental disaster in the history of the US which was caused by carelessness and lack of proper response plans. By the time Feldman gets through chasing his tail it will be a moot point.

Which I support because I spent most my life working in the oilfield and know first hand just how careless and absolutely uncaring they really are. I also know that Bush/Cheney gave them a free ride for close to 10 years now.

They really do need to be reined in and made responsible again.

 

What's not only stupid about this but also just chickenshit in the extreme Ace are these factors.

You cannot eat money you fuckhead, nor those plastic cards you rely on. The banks collapse, the national financial system defaults, and you better have a garden and bullets fool, and game you can hunt while they sort that out.

What part of global financial collapse don't you understand? If that had happened for once in the past 500 years the African bushmen tribes would be the world's leading economies.

Next you're talking plunging the US into a depression greater than the Great Depression.

And finally you rich greedy fuck Ace, we (THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA) would have caused a global economic collapse and then grabbed the money and ran.

Maybe that's the kind of con artist you are Ace but myself, as an American I'm glad that the rest of us made good on what the greedy private sector looted from the rest of the world.

Fuck!! You are so fucking cheap, Ace.

Bull Fucking Shit Ace. Now God damn it you can't keep up with the rest of the world in education when you do not educate. And we don't. We are comparing ourselves on standardized tests in a country that has no fucking standards.

Oh yeah kids that study creation instead of biology are going to keep up with the rest of the kids in the world. Get fucking real. Kids that are tested to the standards of Texas, Mississippi and Tennessee where if you show up you get a diploma are going to score better than countries that actually have national education standards?

Its such a fucking joke especially when we try to educate and test all kids. And when you consider that task and our diversity and poverty our public school system does an amazing job.

And I"m sure that what ever Ivy covered private school you went to was probably better but I don't right good on what I got from public schools.
I was already doing that, before Wisconsin came on the scene.

Typical. If you did know a few teachers, if you'd ever hung around public schools, or better yet ever been in a classroom you'd know that things are actually going far better in our public schools than you think.

The real deal is you have no idea how hard it really is. Especially in a nation that does not have education as one of their core values.

No, no, tell me it ain't so Ace. So you're just looking out for your own interest you're just a dumbfuck brainwashed enough to work against your own best interests.

And Ace I can see the beliefs you've been sold. You know independence, self reliance, freedom to fail or succeed on your own efforts and talent. Hell, that shit even appeals to me. But how many times do you have to watch those fuckers sell you that, rip off us and the economy, and then run to the government to get bailed out before you fucking wise up?

Damn Ace I'm disappointed about that.

But its always the irresponsibility of industries, (GM), insurers (AIG) and Wall Street you're just perfectly willing to overlook and instead blame the workers who put cars together and home loans to low income people instead of the people who profited from it and than ran to the government to get bailed out.

And if this was the first time you might have an excuse. But fuck no Ace because you heard of Chrysler, you've heard of Boeing, you've heard about every fucking industry where the managers made millions for running their industry into the dirt.

Its a really old story and one you've got no excuse for not noticing.

And Ace you also would not last a month without your government and I would have a lot better chance of that than you because at least I know how.

First then let's be clear. The state's financial problems are the direct result of the greed and corruption of the US Financial private sector that once again was allowed to loot a segment of the economy when their conservative/Republican friends were in power.

Then we can look at the choices that include the governor and the republicans backing down, or recalling the republicans that can be recalled now and the governor next January.

Because Ace this is not going like I thought it would. I'll be honest. I fucking cringed when the public school teachers took their case to the streets and almost hid under the bed when they shut down schools. I expected a tsunami of resentment over that.

But it didn't happen and there's a reason for that. And that reason is Unions have support in Wisconsin and now that residents are waking up to what is happening and realizing they've been lied to, the Unions are GAINING support not losing it.

That's bad news for Gov. Walker and worse news for the national conservative/Republican/Tea Party union busting agenda.

And hey Ace where are the JOBS?

We pay lower taxes than almost any developed nation on earth and most of our weathy and corporations don't pay any taxes at all. Look up Halliburton's head office some time and then tell me about paying US Taxes Ace.

And to show you what a hypocrite YOU ARE I bitched like hell when Bush doubled our national debt and kept the cost of two wars off the books instead of rasing taxes to pay for them.

That would have a whole lot fucking better and way more honest than YOUR LIE AND SPEND POLICIES.

 

if you two will leave out the personal name calling and shit, there is good points from the both of you that everyone can use. i would like to add a comment here and there but i cant from a cellphone because i dont have all the buttons and whistles to quote and such

 

stumbler usually makes good points, but he has a problem with anger control. Most of those he gets angry at do not make good points. :idea:

 

I am going to say what obama said when the dems won both houses and the White House.

Elections have consequences, and WE WON. LOL LOL :excited::excited::excited::excited::excited::excited::excited::excited::excited::excited:

Just thought I would add that as no one else has.

So as far as I am concerned the left has nothing to complain about.

 

​

 

While all of you argue, Walker stays the course. This guy has balls.

http://www.npr.org/2011/02/21/133945476/wisconsin-governor-refuses-unions-compromise

 

No, he has his marching orders, from the people who paid for his campaign.

http://thinkprogress.org/2011/02/21/zombie-johnbirch-walker/

 

The propaganda machines are spinning out the rhetoric big time.

He is doing what he campaigned to do, doesn't matter who says what now. "They" had a chance to beat him in the election, but failed.

 

And what's funny to me is they telegraphed the bust the unions punch like a drunk trying to throw a hay maker.

They started this bullshit immediately AFTER the November elections and I'm pretty sure it was news to the Tea Party and most republicans as well.

But what's infuriating to me is Americans who are fools enough to let the richest segment of this nation loot the economy, collapse it, create this recession and then try to blame it on the people working for a living.

 

Check your facts. He didn't campaign on busting public employee unions. What, specifically, in that Think Progress report is false?

 

It's very sad that working-class people can be persuaded to tear each other down instead of focusing on who's really oppressing them.

 

If that's true you can show me where Governor Walker said he was going to do away with collective bargaining in Wisconsin during his campaign.

Let's see you back up what you're saying tenguy or prove you're lying again,

 

Me being the eternal optimist I'm thinking that thanks to those heroic Wisconsin Democrats working class people might be wising up.

Maybe its because where I live but I expected an overwhelming public backlash against the teachers especially for shutting down schools.

But support seems to be growing.

And in the meantime the fight in Wisconsin has spilled over into the other states BEFORE they can try to rush a bill through. Thanks to Wisconsin the alarm has been sounded.

I also think that watching the protests spread across the Middle East is an encouraging example and makes protesting kind of in vogue. That's gotta help.

 

And he isn't trying to bust the unions, just trying to get the process back in the state that it should be in.

Let's look at what his campaign promise on union negotiations was:

 

I do think that's part of the dynamic. My mother says it's almost like the sixties have returned. Power to the people!

I think, as usual, the right wing has overplayed its hand. They win a few elections and they're right out of the gate trying to demolish institutions that have been in place for decades.

 

Do you see anything in that quote about eliminating collective bargaining? No...and yet, that's what he now insists on and says is essential. Except, of course, for the unions that supported his candidacy. Open your eyes, tenguy.

 

Exactly. And its playing out on both the international, national, and local level but what I'm seeing in common in all those protests is "where are the jobs,"

I heard a really good assessment yesterday that the Republicans have misread their "mandate" and that kicking off their traditional pissing contests over abortion and busting unions is a huge mistake that is pushing especially the independents back away from their extremism.

And in the meantime Governor Walker has said he refuses to even consider any compromises. That's another huge downer for people who are tired of government gridlock and entrenched partisan politics.

Good for us beautiful.